Welcome to the land show it's on time weird, isn't it? It's crazy. It's like someone isn't here
We've got some pretty interesting topics this week valve to address review bombing in new update to user review systems
Interesting also even potentially more interesting Facebook patent to use user ads user photos as ads
Mmm, also Amazon workers may be listening to you through your echo device done all this and more roll the intro
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See you displayed
Yes
We'll get to that but first valve
addressing review bombing
You see this pretty often actually review bombing that is yeah tell us about it
so like a new game will come out especially for smaller games where like
100 200 reviews is gonna be a very significant portion of the reviews on the platform
You will see
Brigading where like a group of people decide that they don't like or that they do like
I've actually I believe review bombing has happened in the other direction as well. It's something it's probably more more common on like we need
It's basically up voting it. Let's get this to the front page. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, just just like how on Amazon people can buy
Positive reviews. I don't necessarily know if this stuff is purchased
But you'll get a group of people that whether they've really played a game or not. They have like one minute on record
They're like this is the greatest thing ever very positive review
Yeah, I think I think it goes in in both directions and the ways that valve wants to address this
I think are pretty interesting. This is driving me nuts. There's these headphones that are plugged in right now and
Everything we say is coming out of it all and I could just vaguely hear it on the side
When you review bombing happens, yeah
It's not usually when the game comes out or is it sometimes just randomly like five years later?
Yeah, it can happen way later down the line to one of the interesting ones
It's like a patch will come out more an expansion or something and it'll get tanked at that point in time and on steam
You can see all time and recent
So if you're viewing a game and like the all-time is very positive, but the recent is like very negative
That's pretty bad as well
So it can take a surprisingly low amount of reviews to really sway people's perceptions
Because if you have enough people to slam a game that's decently old
But you can make the recent go to very positive or very negative or whatever way you want to push it
You can really affect people's
Decisions on things. So where are those brigades organized? They usually happen on the subreddit for the game or
Discord or gaming subreddits gaming discord. There's a bunch of different ways
I think there's also a little bit where like this is almost more of a mentality thing
I think there's two so I think there's two other things going on too is is
One if you're like, I'm not really sure and then you see the game and it has mixed reviews
You'll probably go. Yeah and give it a mixed review
If you're like, I'm not really sure but everyone else is reading it very positive. You might go like it was pretty alright
Oh, so I think there's some that happens where it's just things are swayed. But another problem that they're going after is
something that I saw on
And this actually pissed me off. I saw this on a local review of
Mucho burrito recently, okay
Some guy rated it one star because he ordered some mucho burrito from skip the dishes and the like
Delivery was late or something. Ah
That's me. That's a completely unrelated thing. And one of the ways that valve wants to address this is to
This is actually exactly what they're talking about. Yeah with this new announcement. I want to deal with off-topic
Review, right? So let's just like introduce it in terms of the article
Yeah, so in an effort to keep games review scores, which is something we didn't talk about yet
It's not only are people leaving reviews
But the reviews they leave are contributing to an overall review score
And in an effort to keep the games review scores as a meaningful indicator for whether or not someone should buy the game
Valve is now rolling out a new review system for steam that detects off-topic
Review bombing and removes the impact of these reviews from the games review store
Yeah important distinction there. They are not removing the reviews
The reviews are staying on there. You can still read all yeah, they're just removing the contribution of those reviews to the overall score
It's not fair
Let's say there's a a lot of the off-topic DRM things are like are about DRM. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, or
In Steam's estimation here. They have a little criteria. I think that should affect it personally
But well, this is the meat of this topic is the gray area
So we've already defined for you what a review bomb is now
Let's talk about what an off-topic review bomb is
Steam says when the focus of those reviews is on a topic that valve considers unrelated to the likelihood that future
purchasers will be happy if they buy the game and
Hence not something that should be added to the review score
Okay, yeah I see cuz like if we if we pull this away from gaming temporarily if you want to review something on like Rotten Tomatoes
And you went to go review
Hellboy, which is currently 11 out of a hundred
and
You were like thinking about in both sides if you want to rate a movie a zero or just don't do it
Cuz it's Rotten Tomatoes because you went to the theater and the popcorn sucked. Yeah, that would be really stupid
Just like the skip the dishes thing. Yeah, if you wanted to review Hellboy as
Definitely go watch it because the popcorn was great. That's equally stupid. So like I
I'd like the getting rid of off-topic things. I am going to be
Very interested in what they deem as off topic because the DRM thing is extremely on topic in my opinion
So on their announcement blog, there's a section at the bottom underneath where they outline what they're doing
They have a Q&A section and DRM is actually
Specifically called out there and
The cue part is I care about some things that I worry other players don't like DRM or EULA changes
Review bombs have you know changes are also super important review bombs have been about them in the past
You consider them unrelated or off-topic and the answer is
We had long long debates about these two and others like them
They're technically not part of the game
But they are an issue for some players in the end. We decided to define them as off-topic
because
The general steam player doesn't care as much about them
So the review score is more accurate if it doesn't contain them in addition
We believe that players who do care about topics like DRM are often willing to dig a little deeper into games before purchasing
Which is why we still keep all the reviews within the review bombs
It only takes a minute to dig into those reviews to see if the issue is something you care
It's basically no one's gonna do
Well, you they they're saying that the people fair enough
I just said that that's really annoying to me because games like I don't even know if this was on Steam to be completely honest
But the newer Assassin's Creed games
Origins, I believe specifically had a de nouveau or something
I think it had like three different layers of DRM and it was crippling
I I did a stream of that game when it first came out and ran my like CPU usage statistics
The entire time I was playing and would like go into different areas and look at things as well benchmarking it
So I was like, holy crap
This thing is thrashing me way harder than it should be and it was really interesting to to test
That doesn't mean it's a good game for people because the system is getting thrashed and I found it interesting
It does not mean it's good for the general person
But I do think a lot of people should know because it's genuinely really hard for people to run if they didn't have
Yeah, a decent enough. So maybe don't buy it. Yeah, so it's true and that you don't buy the damn game
and then there's there's been was it a
Kerbal space program or something had a really weird EULA update that made it so that like yeah
You probably shouldn't buy this game. Oh, well, I don't I don't I could be super inflammatory saying Kerbal space program
Now I must know
You less by way EULA end-user license agreement guys Kerbal space program's new EULA makes it spyware
Take two is not
Quite the headline. Yeah, I don't know very much about this to be completely clear
And I think it's gonna take quite a bit to dive into but my stance is just going to be that EULA updates are
very important, okay and and
DRM stuff can be very important. I think I think people review bombing every single
Every single game that comes out that has DRM on it is like maybe a little excessive
But when people are like the DRM
Implementation in this game is ridiculous and extremely detrimental and we should probably all get very angry about this
I think that's very valid
Well, luckily for people like you and those who share your opinion you can completely opt out of this
You know entirely opt out
So there's gonna be a checkbox in or I think it's there now
There is now a checkbox in your steam store options where you can choose to have off topic review bombs still
Included in all the review scores you see
Sweet cool. Thank you for the option. Yeah, sounds good
so we have a little bit more information about how they're doing this what their process is basically they made some kind of a
automated tool that looks at the
Frequency of reviews. So let's say a game came out
It's been out for two years and suddenly it gets a huge number of reviews
It'll get flagged and that's all the tool does the tool doesn't try to figure out why or at all
All it does is say hey look at this
Anomalous activity and then a team of humans will then look at it
Okay, and then these people have already been trained at looking at review bombs in the past or off-topic review bombs in the past
Yeah, so they can determine I mean because there's review bombs that are normal, you know
Like a lot of reviews because the game came out today and yeah, and we all love it
Yeah, we all want everyone to buy Red Dead or something risk of rain, too
Green was again that had like almost no marketing and then got
Positively review bombed if you want to call it that because tons of people that played it thought it was amazing
And then it sold really well, it's great
Here's another little wrinkle when they determine that this a period of time represents an off-topic review bomb
they don't have
Much sensitivity and saying which are gonna stay in which are gonna be deemed bad
So it's like okay this weekend this two-day period and just people were like you were getting review bombed
We're gonna remove all of those reviews from contributing to the review score
Well, even if you just legitimately happen to review that day and it was a genuine review
That's not about DRM or EULA or something that they think is off-topic
Your your review is gonna get discount. It's super bad my opinion
Yes, it is. But I think it's a drop in the bucket for the overall score
probably but that's not a
that nullifies
major
Not really because then it if so that nullifies major
EULA and DRM and whatever else they decide is off-topic changes from being noticed by the general public because
most people are not gonna I will most people are not gonna go into their settings and make it so that this thing doesn't apply to
them and most people if
The let's assume the Kerbal Space Program thing is real. I don't know. I'd never looked into it too deeply
I just shared it to one of my friends that plays a game
And I don't know but let's assume that it's spyware now. I don't know
Hypothetically hypothetically, I would want to know that
That EULA is technically an unrelated or whatever they called it
So the recent reviews would still show up as very positive
I believe because I believe that's what Kerbal Space Program is but the recent reviews when that came out made it very negative
The score so the score would be positive the written reviews would still be negative. Yeah
Yeah, but most people aren't gonna scroll through the reviews
They're just gonna go Oh all-time very positive recent very positive sounds good game looks interesting. Let's go
Oh, I think you're just understand what I'm saying. Hmm. What I'm saying is
Let's say everyone goes and bombs it
Yeah
and the scores
Unaltered because they deemed it off topic what I'm saying is if there happened to be a guy who came in and just gave a
Review during that same weekend and was like it doesn't no no, I know I know I know
So what I'm saying with that is like it will nullify any of this news
basically
because no, yeah, I guess cuz that's
Yeah, I know I guess what I'm saying is pretty off
Sounds good. I just I guess still valid
Yeah
I just I don't like the idea that you're nullifying everything because it will make any
Major change that people like that isn't directly related to gameplay
Because I think that's effectively what they're saying is only gameplay things will ever get mentioned
Well, I they're not explicitly saying that that might be like de facto. Yeah, it's
I definitely but it feels like that's what it's gonna end up being any problem that is ever unrelated to gameplay
I'm assuming at this point is just gonna disappear
So you're saying by saying that I think you're indicating that the score is very important
That's the main thing you look at as a user
I would assume it's the main thing that a lot of people look at because it's the main thing that's projected
You'd when you go to a game on the store. Let's let's try this out. Let's look at risk of rain
That's actually the forecast for this weekend on Saturday
Okay, let's go to my screen
Risk of rain 2 it doesn't have a recent because the game just freaking came out
So it makes sense all reviews overwhelmingly positive 10,000 reviews. I don't think most people are gonna click on this
They're just gonna see overwhelmingly positive and go great this game this video. That's auto-playing looks interesting
It's overwhelmingly positive. Maybe scroll down and see how I do to get to you just call my friends play it
Whatever. I think you have to go pretty far
Recent updates about the game key features system requirements more like this what creators save reviews down here
I don't think most people are reading reviews. I
They're they're super buried. I think you can get awful
Sweet straw poll. This is going to be so before we do this drop
Well, I'm gonna say this is gonna be one of the more skewed straw polls that we have
Because we're gonna have a whole bunch of power users
But if it says a whole bunch of power users are not reading reviews
I'm pushing back on that because I don't think you need to be a power user to read reviews because I think we have such
an
E-commerce culture now. I always read the views on Amazon
I'm used to scrolling all the way to the bottom of an Amazon page to get to the reviews. That's a good point
Cuz usually I read all the negative reviews on Amazon or I'll read the run the one stars like you're making a purchasing decision here
I'm gonna read a couple read the top. Yeah top positive top negative. Yeah, let's see in a straw poll. I
Think you're right on that one. Okay. Do you read steam in all capitals?
I am reviews before when you're when you're interested in buying like before you buy do you read a couple reviews or do you just use
the
overall score
Yeah, I'm doing like a little side test thing. Oh, I'm interested. So we're doing yes
No, and no, but I do on Amazon because that's my so that's you and I'm wondering if I'm weird or if that's
You're definitely weird
Yeah, yeah, but like I wonder how much because it did do you read reviews for games on Steam
Well, like if you've already heard of a game and that's why you're there then you don't really need to read the reviews
But that's that's kind of what I'm talking really depends on how many people are just browsing when they're like, I want to buy a game
and I'm just gonna
Browse the store and just find something
It seems like usually it's word-of-mouth like people, you know who you game with are playing that kind of game
I browse quite a bit sometimes you do word-of-mouth if I get word-of-mouth about a product that's on Amazon though
I still very often read the reviews if I get word-of-mouth about a game on Steam
I'll check the positive negative thing because I want to know if something recent did something bad to it
Mmm, because someone might have played a game like Kerbal Space Program, for example
Hypothetically, so I might have played it and enjoyed it for like a year and then this EULA thing comes out
I don't want a spyware game
So they don't necessarily know that because they've just been playing they're not checking the store page
They just wanna play the game so that I would be nice for me to know
And I just do a little quick check and then move on
I wonder I'd like to see the stats on how many people straight up opt out of this
Yes, that would be really put that in your next hardware survey, even though it's not hardware
Chuck it in there
How long do we have to wait before we can look at this poll result?
I want to post it in the YouTube chat really quick
I'm trying to get there
doo-doo-doo
There's so many interesting questions
How do people get new games?
Because you're right like a lot. There's especially in the indie space. There's so many games that don't have a lot of marketing
But then you get buzzed in other ways like apex legends
Obviously, they had influencer marketing but then they do they had millions of dollars in influencer marketing
Yeah, but a lot of people heard about it from other people
Getting a popular like I heard about it like on a Monday when it was like over the weekend
Two million people started playing this game
But that I think was a lot of influencer marketing and then people seeing the influencers and then friends telling each other
It just wasn't spammed in ads here. Wait, let's see
Okay
results
Do you read steam game reviews?
Two-thirds of people said yes buzz in other ways like apex almost a quarter people said no
marketing and only 12%
From other people I'm surprised
Monday when it was like
Majority of the time I don't
If a game is all the time being able to see the influencers and friends telling each other not
It just wasn't spam. You know, it adds if a game is like has a weird disparity
I'm overwhelming. Do you read game reviews?
I mean if a game is like
Oh
Did that fix it
Hello
Did that fix it we're having a technical difficulty here
You're good now, is it okay? Oh, we're good now, okay
It was twitch over here. Apparently we were getting an echo though. It didn't happen last time which is weird
But I ran my laptop now. You should just mute it on this side. Just mute the black magic device
It's it's minimum. It is. Okay, cool minimum
Minimum. Oh, it's not are you sure it's black magic. Did you take the other cards out? Well, then I
Don't know. I think that's time to move to the next topic here. But yeah, it shouldn't take audio from there. Anyways, yeah
Let's move on
Facebook patent Thank You full plain chat for letting me know that was going on a new Facebook patent
Reveals that Facebook is even more out of touch than you could have ever. Yeah. Oh my god
You'd like to read us read us in so basically what what's going on here is they're gonna have an AI thingamajig wait
Hold on
It's a patent. So first of all, that's fair. They're thinking about it. They patent it. That doesn't mean they'll ever become a product
It's not a product right now. They're not doing it right now. Yeah
That's that's a good that's a very good point
But the idea is they could look through
Profile photos on Facebook and look for photos where someone is prominently holding a product
like a coke can or a Doritos bag Doritos bag or
Whatever else where you can clearly see the product and then they would be able to use those photos
They'd be a license to those photos not to you, by the way
But there would be a license to those photos for ads on Facebook
So they would I they would use machine learning algorithms to identify these photos. I think they already do have
Which would probably not be that hard because you just look for a logo and then they'll train
With certain domains first like a can like snacks and stuff seems pretty easy to start with clothing would be way harder
They'll do that later. Yeah, but they'll recognize these photos will identify them and then they'll they'll pitch certain clients like hey coca-cola
Here's a bunch of photos of people holding your product
coca-cola would then use those
Photos as ads that and here's where I'm not clear
Would an ad of me holding a coke can go only to me and my friends or would it go to the whole Facebook network?
What we have written here is
from the article
Did the patent filing suggests that the adverts would only be targeted to a person's Facebook friends if the user had limited their
Private privacy settings that way that that language from that article anyway suggests that the default would be that it goes to everybody
If you're if your privacy settings are public, yeah, I think it would go to everybody
I don't think I don't really think that makes any sense
I don't think they would do that it doesn't make sense
But if they found a particularly good one like a fairly professional photo, yeah, you're a babe. Yeah, they might yeah, I
Don't know
Seems weird but that I actually do see the business sense as creepy as it is and how we're all mad right now
I could see why they would pitch this as a product. Yeah, I mean cold completely blind to civilization businessman
I completely get it as well because you're showing someone their friends. That's cool consuming or using a product
That's what advertising it has always been like
Associating the brand with something you like and you're like forcing word-of-mouth this the safe bet was always like, okay use George Clooney
You use someone we all like but now because it's so personal
Where's this watch? Hey, I happen to know you're friends with this person
How about I just show you them or even yourself like hey remember a year ago and he had all that fun eating those cheeses
Get cheeses again, man. That was a good night. I really hope that this goes poorly and there's like
Someone doing something bad with a product. This is exactly what I think like, oh look at someone drinking Grey Goose
Uh, that's my alcoholic friend. Yeah, that guy's not okay. He's in rehab. Yeah
Like totally shoot yourself in the foot
How are they gonna know? There's no way for them to know. I
Really? Yeah, I really I
Really hope that if this does get put in place, which I hope it doesn't but if it does
I really hope it goes sideways in like glorious ways
I don't see how they could ever really implement this because the the optics are so bad and
And then that's obvious. That's an obvious downside
Easily happen or like you see the amount of times that like what was that Microsoft AI
That people like made racist. Oh, yeah. Yeah, like learn from the people and then they like pushed it. Yeah
Yeah, so like people are people love messing with this kind of stuff. Yeah
I'll just upload pictures of me holding Doritos bag and like yeah my crotch
Yeah, that won't affect it though because remember Facebook identifies it with algorithmically and then hands it to the brand
So people are gonna see it
So you can't just troll like that unless it's a brand that likes that if it's like a weird brand like it's dbrand or something
And I'm wearing only dbrand. They might actually like that brand would be like heck. Yeah
Do you friends hilarious?
So I looked into whether or not remember a few years ago
This is actually a few years ago like that when I was in university
Maybe almost a decade ago. There was a bunch of stuff going around that was like, did you know that you don't own your photos?
Yeah, Facebook owns your photos
Yeah
So I looked into it and at least this I believe this is source to here an article from 2017 said
You know you in fact do own your photos you own them and if you take them away Facebook can't use them anymore
But they can use them while they're on the platform, right? Correct when they're on the platform
Facebook has total license to do stuff with them including sub licensing them to say Pepsi Cola or whatever. So
Start deleting the ones you don't all the times you were photographed holding
Doritos or something just delete them if you don't want this to happen. Yeah. Yeah, or just stop really using Facebook
Delete Facebook nice. Heck. Yeah, it's useful in other ways
Useful in other ways basically the only reason why I have it is getting in contact with people that are sometimes very hard to get
In contact with yeah, there's phone books aren't like really a thing anymore. Yeah, hey, so it's the yellow pages
Yep, it's really good for those weak ties. Yeah, I don't have your number. Yeah, really friends. I met you
You're useful now. Yeah, I want to get in touch. Here's a message
Amazon speaking of are we at halftime? Should we are we yeah, we are pretty much we can do the thing
I don't know what I'm leaning back to do
Squarespace let's do that
I'll also lean back
Part way through I was just like where am I going? I have no idea
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Yeah, you usually get a free one. Yeah my experience with them. Yeah. Yeah. I think you have to sign up for a year because
Buying domain generally lasts for minimum of a year at a time. So that makes sense
but yeah
Moving onwards we have display display display right here. This one this way
Display is a magnet mounted metal print pull it off of there. Well, see you later. Goodbye and then you could be like no
Vancouver's upside down. Whoa, the upside down. What do you think about that? It's abstract or
Utilities need to bludgeon. Oh
a fan
A fan whatever you need you use the corner of it really cut into something heck yeah
They're durable as you probably just saw you don't need any power tools to hang it would clearly which is cool
There's over 260 000 different arts
Spanning a bunch of different styles and influences with their easy metal
Uh with their easy magnet mounting there are no holes in the wall and it's replaceable
I'm, really trying to serve the ocd people out there. This is gonna bother people. Yeah. Yeah, probably me speaking of that though
If you were going to if you hung it originally like that unlike a lot of things you can just turn it back
I'm gonna try to also do a good job. Good luck pal
But like you can you can make sure it's correct after the fact, which is pretty cool
They also plant 10 trees for each display purchased. Whoa, that's a lot of trees per display. That's quite a few trees
Whoa, yeah didn't know that one. Uh, head to our link below and use offer code ltt to save 15 today
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Not bad
Plant 10 trees and buy a thing for your wall and save 15 while doing it
heck yeah
And pyaa
We got a new domain thing, which is cool lmg.dg slash pia wan instead of the crazy long thing
It was pia wan pia wan pia wan. That sounds like an island in the philippines
That'd be good
That'd be cool
If it was uh private internet access supports a variety of vpn protocols and types of encryption and authentication allowing you to
Dial in the exact level of privacy protection you need which is cool. It has apps for windows mac os android ios
It still says linus, but linux, uh, google chrome and support for several other platforms coming soon
You connect up to five devices at the same time apps include dns leak protection and ipv6 leak protection
This one is my favorite part
Actually, the internet kill switch will block all traffic if the vpn becomes disconnected unexpectedly
So you don't have to worry about a security hole
if if
like
If something happens with pia or something happens between you and pia so your connection to them is faulty for a second. No
Data will go through so there'll be no data that is unencrypted which is pretty neat. Oh
Um, check it out today at lmg.com
slash pia wan
Or pia wan pia wan
pia wan
The emphasis matters whether you're talking with the the island or the people that live there
This is a very niche philippines joke here
Amazon
Uh, speaking of not niche. I don't know. Uh, amazon workers are listening in on echo audio report says
Oh people are mad and I don't know why it's lmg.gg
Lmg.gg
Heck yeah
Get out of here. Maybe you should have a better domain. We're past that stage. We're talking about amazon now. Yeah
Apparently it's lmg.gg and I said calm. Sorry about that
See my website is cool and has a.com fullplane.com go subscribe to heck
Yeah, anyways amazon workers are listening to what you tell alexa. What did you say?
You're wondering why people are mad. Yeah. Well, let's talk about it. Yeah, bloomberg
Uh reports. Okay. First of all bloomberg lately
I think they have a road to their trust ever who's been way more off the board than bloomberg in my opinion forbs
Oh, I don't know. I'm just weird stuff. I'm not talking about weird topics
I'm talking about trust because it started with that report they made about the um, sorry forbs
I don't know the chinese like microchip spying a lot weird
A lot of people were like, I don't know doesn't sound credible and then from there. Oh, they had a recent one
And now this anyway bloomberg reports forbs is necessarily not incredible. They just do weird stuff now
The bloomberg reports amazon tasks outside contractors as well as full-time amazon employees
To comb through snippets of audio from echo devices to help train
A-l-e-x-a the company's voice enabled assistant the clips include both explicit
commands
And background conversations presumably background conversations that are caught happening after you say the hot word, uh
Probably kind of whatever
Whenever yeah, what why not?
What do you mean? Why not? There's there's nothing that stops them from doing it whenever
Well, it's not supposed to connect to the servers until you say the hot word. Sure
I'm sure they could do it. Absolutely whenever and they're trying to train it to be better, right?
So they could be trying to train it to pick up the thing is I don't think they have to
I don't think okay. I hate I hear you're saying there like
What if someone says the hot word but then?
They want to hear 10 seconds before that to see if it took that person 20 tries
20 tries
And then they can learn. Okay, you're scottish and this is how you say it or if someone was trying to say it
and failed and gave up saying and then just
A little tinfoil had I think they don't I don't I think they could because there's so many commands every day
But you could go with uh false matches that are fairly high percentage
Yeah, so like they think you might have tried but it wasn't good enough for them to actually activate
They could still listen to those periods of time, but how they wouldn't be able to identify those because it's only going to connect
to the service that only record
When you actually did make a match
Is that 100 true are you sure it only records when you fully make a match?
Yeah, like if you say
um, like
Hi, boogle
Then it's it's it's like nope
Like I have my google home set to go but dink after I say it
Say it and there are times where i'm watching a movie and someone just says something totally on they'll say like
Yes, please, but they say it in a way that sounds like the hot word and it'll go
When i'm just watching a movie because I know
Probably not right now someone in chat's like hi boogle. Uh
I know probably not right now, but for quite a while there the biggest concern was it not detecting when people were trying
Mm-hmm, so I would expect them to try to find the ways that people were towards the audio, but it doesn't do a command
Yeah
Like it could happen like i'm not saying they're gonna i'm not
They record every single word
Anyone ever says anywhere near them and they might but I kind of doubt it but from an engineer perspective
It's like hey, these are the weak points. Yeah, and you would want to learn how to improve that
Yeah, so I could definitely see them passing through recorded audio and being like what was this?
Was this supposed to be an accurate match?
Uh was did our system rate it maybe a little too highly
Was it someone on a tv show saying something completely unrelated another related issue to that was um, I mean
We haven't really even explained the whole story yet. You get it though
There's they want to train this machine to do a better job and surprise. They're using humans to do that
You thought maybe they were just putting more computers on it, but obviously humans are really good at speaking
So if you want to train this thing to speak better, you just take the snippets that are you're giving the machine and let humans
Annotate and to tell the machine how to do it better
It's pretty obvious they're using humans, but I guess no one amazon never explicitly said they were doing that on their website
It says that um user requests are applied to train our speech recognition and natural language understanding systems
It doesn't say with humans
But it also doesn't not say that so I think if you think about it for a bit you would assume that they're using
Yeah, no, i'm not surprised at all. I and I always thought they were
Yeah, and it's not just amazon. They're all doing this. Yeah, apple does this
google does this as well i'm very surprised this was news because
How else are you supposed to yeah, of course
Yeah, it's pretty weird I I think
One thing that does concern me is like do they sell this data?
Uh, because they're so they're super unrelated and this might I don't
Really use these devices too often. So I don't know
um, but I I have one but I just
It's right by my computer. So I usually just end up using a browser anyways, I don't know whatever. Um,
but like do outside apps have
Listen, I guess but like read access to these files effectively
Uh, I don't like could an app that ties into your echo
Get read access to your voice to try to figure out
Its side of things better I don't think so probably not no
I don't think so. I think it uh, but like that so my reference for this very shot in the dark thing
Yeah, I totally i'm not surprised you say I don't think so
But my reference for that is the gmail thing that happened forever people were
personally reading those emails and there was apparently accounts of people like
Finding funny videos and emails and sharing it to each other for laughs and stuff
So first of all, it would be this is pretty unrelated. This would be text right because it's gonna go
Right to google servers and be transcribed as text and then they wouldn't even get the raw text. I wouldn't think
um because or I would think they wouldn't get the raw text because google would have to say oh audio turn it to text and
Then determine. Oh this text is relevant to that third party and then hand that command over so they probably do get the text
So they probably do get the text, but I don't think they almost certainly don't get it
I don't think they even get the raw text. I think they get the
determination of what that text was
Because and there are some commands you have to issue on random tvs. I've seen this where you have to be. Hi boogal ask
Third party to do this like hi boogal ask lg to turn off the lights
Okay, and then that's just like maybe in that case because you're explicitly saying ask lg then lg would get the full thing
I don't know. I'm not i'm not sure how these interactions work. Well, one point I wanted to make was
You would think intuitively that when they're listening to these
These uh voice clips that they would be a random sample a big swath from all the users
But maybe it's not maybe there's some users that they're listening to more like maybe
maybe if you have a scottish accent or an accent that has
Uh conventionally been very difficult for these they're like, oh that guy's great. We're gonna train on that guy
I mean there's overfitting problems in machine learning if you only use a few examples like that
But they it might be a subset of the population that's getting listened to more often
Yeah, I suspect it would be if you have like a super
Generic voice for an area that has a very high population
It's less likely that I guess yours would be used for sampling super often
Yeah, or if you're if they're trying to break into a new market and they or they know that they suck at that market
And they only have a few on the forefront of technology in that area
Yeah, like well, we only have 10 people from glasco. We're gonna use all of them. Yeah a lot
Yeah, but there's some other interesting things in this story. Um
The big question everyone's mind right now is probably like hey when they're listening to this voice clip of me. Do they know it's me
In the case of amazon it appears that they know your first name and like there's a product serial number or something
But they don't have your last name or other any other identifying things in the case of apple
I think they have less than that. They don't have your first name and they have a randomly generated number to associate to your account
Um, so it's pretty safe. That said
The clip can contain uh sensitive information. I could be talking about my friend's full name
I could be talking about my bank stuff. I could be talking about anything. I looked into my own
This was years ago. Uh, it's probably better at detection now, but I looked into my own like, uh, hey boogal
Information that probably worked actually. Yeah, I I say that's why you say hi. That's why I said hi. Yeah
That's why I said hi. Yeah. Anyway, my bad. Um, but I I looked into like all the different
audio snip recording things the amount of times that I was in the car and just like an audiobook or the radio was on
Where definitely no one said that and it just has a recording of that is insane
Oh, wow, the amount of recordings there are of me not trying to interact with it is wild. Wow, like many hundreds
Well, you don't how do you know for sure that definitely no one said that because I believe that after the hot word
Then there's a delay and then the recording so the audiobook I would be silent in the car
But the audiobook could have said it like a second before they're like star wars audiobooks
Generally, you would be surprised like like I said mine's beside my couch and I can hear it when it gets activated
And you'd be surprised sometimes what activates it i'd be like i'm sure there's a sound that sounded something like whatever
Um, maybe some alien has a weird name in star wars
But like the amount of times what all I was saying is unintentional stuff that ends up in there
Yeah, and you're saying like, uh personal information obviously star wars doesn't count for that
But there was a lot of other recordings as well. It was just like a random I can
Barely even remember the conversation, but it's clearly a random conversation between me and a friend and we're clearly not trying to interact
I see what you're saying
A lot of what happens to me is i'll have people over like a dinner party or something
I'll interact with it to change the song and then I know I can just kind of turn away and keep talking
and I know that the machine will
Will know that what i'm talking about now isn't relevant. So even though it'll even though the light's still blinking
It'll be like yeah, and I can just keep having my conversation, but that's going to be recorded
Yeah, there's gonna be an extra eight seconds of me talking about tacos
Yeah, I don't know um
This is the kind of stuff where like a lot of a lot of modern technologies in various ways you give up certain
Privacies or securities to have those technologies and this is one of them if you want to have a smart speaker in your home
Understand this stuff and move forward you're you're caring about your security is very important. It's probably fine though salt
They were told eventually that amazon it was not amazon's responsibility to take action
So, you know they go to their manager
You guys someone at the company has the means to find out who this is
Like should we tell the authorities and say, you know, like someone got beaten up here
Like they should get a record or something like that
One of the big problems with this is um
Just like roleplay bdsm, etc, etc, etc
We're like it could be totally above board
And now there's the police knocking on your door because you have a ai helper robot thing. Yeah, and you never
Authorized maybe it's a movie. Yeah, totally appreciate the idea
Of reducing those types of things but the minority report also freaks me the hell out. Mm-hmm. And
There's a lot of stuff that could make someone think that that are okay
Yeah, yeah. Yeah, it's not it is not their responsibility. That is true. I think I agree with amazon's can be used as evidence
but I think that's
Whether you think that's okay or not, that is definitely a totally different thing
They're not being proactive. They're reacting to law enforcement like they're not being proactive
Law enforcement like it's whether you think it's okay or not. I think they're in totally different segments. I agree with you there
Yeah, super chats super chats. Let's go
They're like normal chats, but uber
Super bunch of people sending one dollars with no text. I appreciate it. Very nice. Appreciate you
Um, someone's asking about some lag on flow plane, I think we know what's going on there, but uh, it seems like it uh,
Did go pretty well today every week. It's improving a little bit
I like the pictures you guys have on the wall. Cool
Go to full plane and buy luke a better office heck yeah, I like my office right now
But we do have to move because lmg is expanding so darn fast. You guys gotta move eventually because here's gonna be out of space
Yeah, like actually good god. Yeah
The rate at which lmg is hiring is just wild and flow plane's hiring too and i'm trying to bring people in locally
Like there's there's one will is moving here
Very soon. Oh one of the new hires that we have is a canadian. He'll be moving here locally
So like within the next six months, we'll probably have
Two more people locally. Yeah, and there's other people moving in locally. That's all it takes honestly
Like if we're already oversized at that point if but between the two companies there are six more people it'd be over done
Yeah, and that's gonna happen really soon. Yeah, so like i'm i'm actively looking for other places. It's gonna be really weird
But oh well
Are you still gonna come over for friday wands?
It'd be sweet if you guys were just in this complex or something
So I wanted that too, but realistically these are all feelings aren't suited for that really. Yeah, we just need office space
Yeah, so it's like probably go downtown be one of those like exposed brick polished concrete super so expensive
Yeah, you're a startup though, baby
Get that investor cash
There's a yeah, just reading about people in our space not even necessarily competitors
But in our space they're like, oh, yeah, they just got like 20 to 40 million dollars in vc. I'm like, oh, oh geez
Yeah
People talking about the audio. Apparently the focus was screwed up like the whole show the focus is for like the back of our chairs
So when when you and I are leaning forward, we're like super focused. Oh, well, so that sucks. Um, did they offline us?
No, he was away and then his plane came in late. I believe. Oh, I didn't know that
Um, I don't think he was planning to come ever though. Probably not because like he was in england today
So his his time shift is gonna be super weird. Yeah
I dare you guys to eat the carolina reaper savage jerky. I don't think they were sponsored this week
So we don't have any here, but we've done it before
On my very first wan I did that. Oh, damn
Alexa and google home do save recordings where nothing happens. I just researched this and tested for a class project
Send us your paper bro. Yeah, i'm interested do it up email me your thesis
Luke from one broadcast dye your hair green
Oh, I think green's ugliest hair color and love from well actually depends on the green
Oh, I think green's ugliest hair color and love from well actually depends on the green
I think it can be definitely it can be yeah. Anyways, that's it for super chats. I believe we're wait. Are we done? No
We have one more topic. Yeah
There's one more
Oh, I see what people are talking about. Sorry about that. There you go
What is the one more walmart adding more robots walmart already employs many robots. They're getting lots more
They have announced that they will deploy
1500
new
Auto c autonomous floor cleaners, you know, like those floor cleaner things that people ride on like me
That kind of like those ambonis. I think they don't need those anymore
But 1500 how many walmart locations are there if it's not very many in the in the
Grand scheme of walmart like here. Okay walmarts are large though
I'm gonna make a guess how many walmart locations are there's 50 states. They're in multiple countries
I'm gonna say three thousand
4700 that's actually
I guess it's more than you thought. I was guessing around 6k. So do you think that they're gonna get one floor cleaner per store?
Like in their test the subset of stores that are testing this do you think they're getting more than one?
Yeah, no, I think they'd just get one just one. Okay, because if it's automated it can cruise around and do whatever all night
Yeah, yeah. Yeah, so walmart is getting one thousand five hundred auto c autonomous floor cleaners
They're getting only 300 auto s shelf scanners. What does that thing do?
Probably just check inventory how i'm picturing like those like
Surveillance drones in star wars that are like those balls with all the antennas like just hovering down the aisles. You can pop up
That'd be awesome. I I suspect it's just gonna ride along the ledge of the shelf
You think it's I don't know. I don't know. I'm really not sure
They're getting an additional
1200 fast unloaders to scan and sort items as they come off delivery trucks. This one's interesting
Plus to streamline online orders, it'll have 900 pickup towers
So customers can order something on the company's site and pick it up from a vending machine at the nearest walmart
Pick up. Oh, that's less interesting though. I thought it was because walmart was like building towers across the country
I'm, just like this is getting very medieval corporate. It's just a big but it's just it's just yeah, and it's at a walmart location
It's really not that interesting at all. Just buy from the store. Yeah, holy cow
The idea is that by pushing menial tasks to the robots walmart's human employees
Can spend more time helping customers and preparing online orders for pickup. That is sweet bull crud
Yes, they'll just fire them
They'll replace them eventually. Yeah, but it is I guess in the meantime while they're unsure in the meantime
It's like hey, you don't have to do this anymore. So you can just help people which is cool
We got a few years of awesome
Yeah, and then a lot less people have jobs it sucks when you're walking around a store and you're like who works here?
And then you see someone who works there and they're doing something
and you're like, hey, can I bug you and they're like
I guess one thing i've always wanted
Um, especially at home depot is like and home depot has an app and that I believe is supposed to do this
But last time I tried it it sucked but maybe it's gotten better because I haven't tried it forever
But I want to be able to be on my phone in the store and just be like where the heck is this thing?
And have it tell me turn left because that's pretty much the only reason why I ever need
Our employees. Yeah for sure. Where the heck is this? Like the last thing I needed was like a shelf peg
it's like where
Where would that be?
A shelf peg. Yeah, like what's that like like the little like clear plastic little l shape thing that you put in the hole
on a shelf to hold the individual oh like a bracket like
like a
That you put shelves on no, no, but they're like super tiny. Oh like this big
It has a little metal nubbit and there's a whole drill. Did you say nubbit nubbit? I don't know what to call it
Okay, I wouldn't know where to buy that either dude, right? It's it's hard to find it
Okay, I wouldn't know where to buy that either dude, right? It's hardware and the canadian tire has it
Island shelf ex that's cool. That's sweet. But like do you have to install an app? I know I just said there's nubbit have two t's
What even new bits world's best stable digital currencies
Nubbit two b's maybe nubbit. What is a nubbit dude?
urban dictionary nubbit
Oh, geez
It's a word now
Yeah, someone make a new entry. Yeah, there we go a nubbit make it not the one that's on there
It's like a nubbin. No just their site. Okay, that's cool
Be able to use apparently canadian tire website to look for an item and let you know where it is
I would like but how do they let you know? They say like island island shelf. It's good enough. That's pretty good. Yeah
one thing
Can I just say i'd like to have a beep i'd like to have a warmer colder
Or
Is that an alien
They're really close to us
Maybe I think so. I think that's the original alien stuff. Yeah, I don't think that's predator. So yeah, I think so, but I I like
One thing that I think is pretty important too, though
Is that it needs to be able to be pretty good at guessing what the heck you're talking about
Yeah, because especially in a place like like home depot or lows or whatever where it's like hardware
you know people are gonna go in there and be like I need a
a screw
It's like what screwed it's like it. Uh this one
Like I don't know it would be cool if you can take a picture or something like well
You bought is even remotely close to what you searched. They'd be like, uh, that's what he meant by nubbit
So we can learn what the heck nubbit is over time
Um shelf nubbits heck. Yeah, I I I called them
The reason why i'm like particularly triggered about this shelf peg thing is because I it took me
I think four or five employees to find it. Oh, yeah, because i'd ask one and they'd send me somewhere to get in there
And be like this is planks of wood. This is not
Plastic things with little metal things coming out of them. They just they didn't accompany you
They just sent you and see you later
But like honestly, they're so freaking busy each one of them were helping like three or four people they couldn't move
I didn't blame them. They need more a they need more auto c's and auto s's. Yeah to help them
Come on home depot figure it out. But yeah, you're right eventually it'll just be
No one working the checkout. It'll be guest service and a couple of people walking around and that's it. Yeah
And even then that's just an ai it just rolls around. How are you doing today?
And if they have to you can do a live chat, you just get someone up on the screen. Yeah
All right, you just have a call effectively. What do you need?
How did you get elevated to this?
The nubbits are over there. Why did you press zero five times? Come on. Give me a break. It's a friday
Yeah
I don't know I kind of
Is it I don't know if i'm naive or just a butthole, but I kind of welcome
the um
If you disappear store of jobs automated check out
Really? That's not the direction. I thought you were going. Yeah, like i've been to a mcdonald's once in australia and these um, use the self
Menu thing save someone's job and go up there and I was like
nope
I would like to send the signal that I prefer this
I don't think anyone should work at the front of this. I don't I don't know. I think maybe because how do you want to solve?
I'm a techno optimist. Yeah. Yeah, because I believe I like to believe that in the eventual future where no one's working there
The people that are working are getting paid a lot and the people aren't working are on a beach
Playing guitar and I love this idea. But how do you like fund those people?
Corporate taxes corporate taxes. Okay. I don't have all the answers man. I'm not like no you've all hirari or whatever
but I think one of my one of my problems there is
Like you would need this is going super off topic and the show is almost over so we can cut it pretty quick. But
Like how aggressive are your allowances for small business then because there's a lot of
Industries like the one float plane is trying to get into now
That to penetrate properly you're going to have to get relatively large
Yeah, you mean stuff like content if we had
Super aggressive corporate taxes so that people that would be working at mcdonald's
And they don't actually need to do that job because that should be automated relatively quickly because we're wasting human potential
Can go sit on a beach or make art or whatever if our corporate taxes have to pay for that we're screwed
When we have to go up against
These giant companies. Sure. There's other proposals
Someone had a proposal about um making robots pay income tax. I think
The economist uh magazine was like that's a bad idea. I read that article. I don't remember why it's a bad idea but um
I'm not saying that the tools we have now are going to be sufficient in that world. I think I
I am very strong in that
I am very strongly in agreeance that like
Wow, we're going way off topic here
But like the just the the mass waste of human potential is is amazing
Just what the lengths people will go to and and the fact that like someone can be very good at something
but
Modern hiring processes have not really gotten much better in like a really long time
So you have to even if you're an extremely skilled person at something you probably have to go through
the walmart or mcdonald's or whatever grind so that you can like
Eventually land a job somewhere good like the placement of very skilled people is not very good. Yeah, especially if you're an immigrant
Yeah, yeah, there's a lot of different situations. I'm an engineer
I'm a doctor i'm driving a taxi. I like and taxis that should probably be automated why we're so close to that being done
The whole transportation industry is just going to poof. Maybe that's good driving a vehicle is not
driving a vehicle on
Most situations there are obviously certain situations where it's extremely highly skilled
But in most people's day-to-day driving vehicles a menial task. Yeah
Let's automate that stuff get people to get rid of it. Thanks, but it's just how do you support those people?
Anyways, it's gonna be short-term hard
Yeah short-term extremely difficult. Yeah for individuals whose lives matter
Yeah, so let's end the show. Yeah
Thanks for tuning in folks outro
Oh, geez, I didn't set it back. There we go. One more plug for this plate right here. Yeah
And you're dead
When when when some guy made an account ian nubbit
There's another person just made straight up just another nubbits ian nubbit you're a legend
Frodo Frodo nubbits. There's so many nuggets
The marked nubbit. What's happening?
I didn't notice this at all. Welcome to the nubbit show. Heck yeah
Everybody make the name something and end with nubbit. It will be our inside joke not inside joke anymore
Very outside display
pia
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