What is up? How y'all doing? Happy Friday, and welcome to the WAN Show. We've got a bunch
of great topics for you today, actually. In the biggest news from this week, NVIDIA figures,
you are made of money.
Just tons of it.
Just lots of it.
Coming out of everywhere.
It's coming out of every orifice simultaneously. You have money diarrhea, money vomit, money
ear drips, money sinus infection that's getting all over everything. So we'll be talking about
their announcement for the RTX 4000 series of graphics cards, along with some alternatives
that might cost you a little bit less money. We've got some ideas. In other, you have too
much money and not enough brains news. Logitech just launched the, uh, what is this stupid
thing called? The G cloud gaming handheld, I think at least a single use case for it.
So we'll talk about that later. I will fight you. I will fight you. I don't care how magnificent
your hair looks. I will fight you. I spent an actually significant amount of time trying
to find a way to make this work. All right, what else we got? We have something that's
kind of interesting for us, which is YouTube adding shorts views to their partner program.
That's actually a big deal. If you view anything on YouTube, like for the industry. Yes. Yep.
Um, and where do I go from here? There's a couple of different options. Sure. Yeah, let's
do it. I know nothing about this. I mean, there's Twitch drama, I guess. Yeah. It was
like that. Or do I talk about video game donkey, which we're going to talk about. All right,
let's roll the intro. We're talking about a lot of stuff. Yeah. It's going to be good.
You'll like it. Yeah. Yeah.
Have a good one, Dan. The show is brought to you by Shadow Keoxia and Epidemic Sound.
Uh, all right. First of all, let's get this out of the way. Yes. Can confirm for those
of you asking the unnamed major YouTube YouTuber that we sponsored to do a video about the
LTT screwdriver or featuring the LTT screwdriver was Marquez. I actually ran into him at a
summit, um, over the last couple of days. It's over now, so I guess I can say that it
took place, but, uh, we were, we were chatting about it and I think we're both pretty darn
pleased overall. Like the community reaction to it was just like, this is hilarious. I
love it. Um, and you know, I think for both of us, it was not an obvious outcome. It could
have, yeah, it could have very easily been like, I don't come on MKBHD to see Linus stuff
or computers. Yeah. Or like what, what are you doing? You know, sponsoring other YouTubers.
He doesn't even build computers all the time. Like you never know. Right. Like there could
be any number of, of wild interpretations of what was going on, but from, you know,
my point of view, and I think from his, it was actually pretty simple. It was, it was
a collab in the sense that there was a cross pollination between the channels, between
the audiences, but also we did sponsor the video, which is not really any different from
what anyone else would do. And from my point of view, I just wanted to see him do a computer
build again because it'd been almost 10 years. Yeah. It had been almost 10 years. It's been
a hot minute. Yeah. The last time he did it was, um, a hackintosh. That makes sense. Which
is like, yeah, it's clearly been long enough that Apple's over it. So that'll give you
some idea, right? Yeah. So yeah, it was, uh, yeah, it was, it was pretty fun. It was pretty
cool overall. It was a pleasure working with their team and that's what it was. And don't
be surprised if you see the screwdriver popping up in other places. Zach from JerryRigEverything
has already had his creator edition screwdriver make a little cameo and you'll, you'll see
a lot more than that. If we get our way, obviously we think it's a really great screwdriver.
We have sent it out to a bunch of people. They're under no obligation to, to show it
in any way. But, uh, obviously, you know, we'd, we'd feel the love. So, so that's pretty,
that's pretty cool, I guess. And I, I figure after that, we got to jump right into the
big topic, right? Yes. Nvidia figures what? You guys have a lot of money. You should buy
more merch, I guess. Well, let's talk, let's talk about this, right? Because what is the
rationale here? Okay. So, so, okay. Let's role play. Okay. Uh, I'm going to be Nvidia
CEO, Jensen Huang. Okay. Wow. And you're going to be fantastically wealthy. You're going
to be a gamer. Okay. Beautiful kitchen. You had a nice jacket. I was going to say you
haven't even complimented my jacket. Okay. So I'm, I'm Nvidia CEO, Jensen Huang, and
uh, I'm going to try and sell you on the RTX 4090, which is coming on October 12th. It
looks like it is going to be shockingly fast. Uh, some cool new features, DLSS 3.0. Uh,
how many fricking CUDA cores does this thing have? I don't know. We don't actually have
like a spec, a spec chart here and I don't remember off the top of my head, but, uh,
Oh yeah, here we go. Here we go. Here we go. We got some images on the LTT forum. Hey,
massive, shout out, big streams on the LTT forum for posting this. Um, they're saying
up to two X to three times the performance of the 30 oh, two to four times the performance
of the, uh, 30 90 TI, uh, 24 gigs of GDDR six memory. Uh, where's my, where's my CUDA
cores at? Yeah, here we go. Here we go. Compare 40 series specs. Here we go. Let's just go
ahead and show my screen for a minute here. 40 90, 16,384 CUDA cores, 2.5 gigahertz boost
clock. That's unreal. 384 bit bus. Um, three slot card. Yeah. 450 Watts with a required
system power of 850 Watts. That seems optimistic. I guess we'll see how that goes. Um, why would
you want to give me $1,600 for it? Well, the power cable and power supply situation is
a little sketchy. Okay. But like realistically, you've got $1,600. So just buy another power
supply. You just hot swap everything, even if it melts after two hours of gaming. Yeah.
Yeah. I mean, well, it's not going to melt. Come on, gamer. Be realistic. Didn't that
actually happen? Oh, I don't know. Maybe I was, I was skimming through a J's two cents
video earlier today. And he was talking about how like there, the, the cable that you need
is rated for like 30 plugs or 30 plug cycles. Hmm. 30 like three zero. Yeah. But like he
noticed changes, he was sitting there doing it and he noticed it like start to feel different
just while he was sitting there doing it like five or 10 times. And, uh, he said that bending
the cable, like everyone does when they're cable managing their cable will like significantly
reduce the life cycle of it. Um, it just, yeah. Well, you've got $1,600. So when it
wears out, why don't you just buy another one? Yeah. I, I think it would be extremely
hard to convince me right now if I was a buying consumer of graphics cards to buy one of those,
uh, unless I just hated money compared to what's happening to the used market right
now. Okay. But you still haven't answered my question. I mean, why not? Why not just
buy a, buy a 40 90 money? I, I mean, we'll just go earn more. What's the matter? Do you
not have money? No. Okay. Because like I have lots of money, so why don't you have lots
of money? We should, we should, uh, you should, you should look into an incubator program,
an incubator program. So, so just to be clear, guys, we're role-playing Nvidia CEO, Jensen
Huang, and Luke is a gamer. Yeah. Um, I should look into an incubator program, right? But
the one who needs to figure out how to make more money. Yeah. You're the one who needs
to make more money. So you should start an incubator program for other people. Look,
look, look, look, look, look. Okay. Shut up. None of that is my problem. I have 40 nineties
to sell. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. I've booked all this allocation with TSM. Well, you screwed
over EVGA. No, no, no. See, I don't want to talk about it. There's some question marks
about no, I've got, I've got these, I've got these 40 nineties to sell. Okay. I need $1,600
for them. So you got to do your part. I did my part. I got another job. Yeah. So I feel
like that's the least that you could do. The least that you could do. What a, what a fantastic
way to send it off. Um, okay. So in all seriousness, people are going to buy them and what's the,
what's the rationale here though? Like it was, this was okay. Was the design of these
cards done during, you know, pandemic era pricing when they, when they didn't think
that when they thought they could just spend, spend, spend, is it a, is it a super expensive
board? What's the justification here? Help me. They may have commit to certain things
during pandemic era stuff, but most of these designs happen way further out than that.
Right. Ah, man, you can be finalizing the board design in the months leading up to launch.
I think there could have been some changes, but I think the, like the main goal would
have already been established. Um, he, he does say that chip prices going down is a
quote unquote story of the past as wafer costs have increased and Moore's law dies, which
I think is extremely convenient if you are a big fan of leather jackets and excessively
expensive kitchens. Yeah. And the other, the other issue with that is that we kind of experienced
that with the 30 series, right? Where they went way up in price as, uh, as their, as
the chip shortage went on and, and you know what, it's not like we didn't see news of,
of chip fabs like TSMC saying, Hey, yeah, pricing is going up. That, that did happen.
And it's not like that has unhappened necessarily. But the issue is that the actual like sand,
the actual GPU itself is a fraction of the total cost of the board. So even if it went
up 25% or even if it went up by double, that doesn't necessarily mean that a top tier GPU
should cost this much more than it did last time around. And honestly, for the alleged,
obviously we haven't tested it yet, but for the, uh, announced performance of the RTX
3090, um, it's not, it's not that far off as long as you accept the premise that the
performance per dollar isn't going to change. Right. If it is that much faster than a 3090
TI, okay, fair enough. I guess it's not that outlandish where we really start to run into
trouble is as we make our way down to the 4080 and the, um, 4080 12 gig, which is as
far as I can tell, not a 4080 or even necessarily a 70 class card at all. And I remember us
talking about this back when Nvidia launched, I think the first time they pulled this move
was with the 680. So you guys will have to go way, way, way back in time with us. Uh,
what was the code name of that GPU? A GTX 680 GPU, uh, code name. So that would have
been Maxwell. Was that Maxwell? I can't even Kepler. Okay. So that GPU was called G K one
Oh four. And typically the way that Nvidia names their dies is that you've got G is for
G force. The next letter is for the, the generation for the architecture. So it's G K for Kepler.
And then, um, you'll have to forgive me. I'm actually not sure exactly what the 10 is.
Is that because it's 10 series? Can't remember. That might be the generation or something
like that. Anyway, the number I'm really focused on is the last one, the four and the way that
Nvidia determines that last number is the lower the number, the bigger, the dye. So
a G K 100. Um, I can't remember if they had a G K 100. So again, you'll have to forgive
me. It might've been like G K one Oh two or something like that. Uh, G K they had one
10. There we go. So one 10 would have been the, Oh no, no, no, no, no. Hold on, hold
on, hold on, hold on. You'll have to forgive me. Where are all the dye names? Give me the
dye names. I need a thing. Here we go. Uh, G K M G K one Oh four is as low as it went
for that one. That doesn't sound right. GTX. Cause what was the, uh, what was the seven
80 seven 80, uh, code name dye. Hold on. Come on. Come on. I think one Oh four was the lowest
and then they just like stretched it. Is that right? Cause I thought that no, no. G K one
10 was the big one. Oh, okay. And I think the second number was because it was a, like
a, a, a mid refresh. So anyway, the point is that G K one Oh four. Okay. So when they
launched the six 80 it was a much, much smaller dye compared to the proceeding five 80 and
the dye size itself was more in line with what you'd expect from a five. It was either,
I think it was a five 60 like class product. Um, and so what that meant essentially was
that Nvidia had, I mean to their credit, done such a good job of optimizing the Kepler architecture
compared to the proceeding Fermi architecture that they could get away with competing with
AMD's top tier product with a mid range product. So that was to my knowledge the first time
they took what would ultimately end up being the second down tier dye design, the smaller
dye and got away with branding it as an 80 class product. Then when they released the
uh, the 700 series, which was also Kepler. So that was Kepler again, rather than an actual
architectural change, we got to see big Kepler and that was the, the big, the big dog G K
one 10. Um, so that's where you've got that zero at the end. Um, it looks like the numbers
are not always that straight forward. So a G, Oh my goodness. Okay. I'm not, no, I'm
not even gonna, I'm not even gonna dig into any of this. So there was a two Oh eight.
If I recall correctly, that was like when they did the, um, I don't know, there was
another thing. It doesn't matter. The point is the lower these numbers, typically the
bigger the dye. So what we can see here is that when we look at the dye code names for
the 4,000 series and when we look at the, um, the memory bus width, not only is the
40 is the 80 class getting a step down design with only a 256 bit bus, but the four 80 12
gig is actually getting a wimpy 192 bit bus. Um, so what that seems to suggest is that
Nvidia aside from not using like a 70 80 class dye for this supposedly 80 class product is
actually using like a 60 product class dye. Um, so we're getting like a, a much, much,
much smaller dye. And so the reason that I'm so focused on dye size is that that tends
to be generation by generation. What determines the relative cost? Because that's what you're
paying for. So you got your wafer, which is about like yay big. And then the cost per
wafer is some cost with all the processes that you have to apply to it in order to turn
it into finished chips. Then you slice it up at the end and whichever, whichever individual
chips do not have egregious problems with them turn into finished products, right? So
if you, if there is a problem on the wafer, uh, wherever the problem is, whatever dye
that problem sits within is, is ruined. And so your yields are going to be, I mean, almost
nobody actually discusses yields, but there'll be somewhere between zero and a hundred percent
and they'll never be a hundred percent because good luck with that. And they'll never be
zero because that wouldn't be a viable product because you wouldn't be able to actually make
any of them. So within that wafer, which has some cost, you can either slice it up into
a few big chips, which also increases the chances of each of those having some kind
of error or problem, or you can slice it up into many small chips and those are your more
budget oriented products. There's areas they're more contained. Yeah. And so you are going
to see wafer costs continue to rise. But even then, what we've seen so far is that that
increase in wafer cost has not necessarily resulted in a, in a, in an increase of 50%
or a doubling a generation over generation of cost. And you need only look as far as
like Intel's, you know, whatever their, whatever their, their top tier consumer chip is year
after year after year, these dye sizes have not gotten much, much smaller and their prices
have not gotten much, much higher. They've tended to go up by, you know, five to 10%
generation by generation, not in the same kinds of leaps that Nvidia seems to be targeting
here. So I think that aside from just being mad
about it though, what can we do is the question. Nothing. Well, there's a couple of things
you can not buy it. Okay. That's one. And we've seen based on what's happened with 30
series. Oh yeah, right. So it comes back to the whole thing that happened with 30 series.
Exactly. What drove the increase in price was demand, not the cost of building it. I
think we can all see that very clearly now. I want people to make sure that they don't
forget that while a retailer pricing and scalper pricing was going up, MSRP was also going
up behind it. Yep. So these like, Oh, compared to previous MSRP, it's like, yeah, compared
to which one, because this product had MSR creep over time. Yes. So I'm comparing to
the launch MSRP of the 30 series, which Nvidia clearly felt was sustainable. TSMC did hike
wafer rates during the, the Silicon shortage, which was real and is still real. There are
still industries that are affected by chip shortages. There's still like a massive, massive,
massive amounts of trucks and other vehicles just sitting in locks. Absolutely. It's just
that high end GPUs is not one of those industries at the moment. Yeah. So what I'm, so the reason
I'm comparing to the 30 series at MSRP is because I think that's a very reasonable way
for us to look at this because 30 series at launch was clearly going to be sustainable.
And while prices have clearly risen, Nvidia can clearly sell them at their original MSRP,
which is what they're doing now. I doubt they're taking a loss on them. I suspect that they
simply aren't making as much margin on them, but Nvidia is a public company, so we'll see
soon enough if they actually had to write down this inventory or not. And I think that
with enough pressure from either competition or from consumers that we will not have to
put up with this for an entire generation, but all right. I'd like to think that I suspect
I'm going to have time and time again that consumers have no spine and will buy anything
that is offered to them. So I don't think that's actually going to put much pressure
on it at all. The only thing that might put pressure there is if it is actually just bad
because people will drop whatever, like your net. I don't think we're ever going to be
able to pull everyone together and be like, don't buy it because pricing is bad and we
need to hold out. We need to put a boycott on it. I don't think that'll function at all.
But if it's just not a good idea, if it's just a bad deal, whatever, maybe less people
will buy it. But seeing how video cards go, I think people are just going to rush out
and do it anyways. Now AMD is announcing RDNA 3 GPUs November 3rd. And I have more hope
now that I know the chiplet. Yes, me too actually. That's actually really cool. I had very little
hope before I heard that. AMD GPUs have just been like a meme for so long time. Yeah. Really
long time. It's been, it's been hard to recognize the GPU side of the business as the same company
that's been absolutely like slaying the giant on the CPU side. Oh yeah, absolutely. But
now that I know RDNA 3 is a chiplet design, which is exactly what has caused such a thorn
in Intel's side, I can't help but be kind of excited. I mean, Apple has, has kind of
shown us, has shown us that a multi, multi component GPU with a high speed interconnect
can work. Yeah. I mean, uh, what, what is it, which I can't, I can't, I hate their naming
scheme so much, but it would be the M1 Pro Max or whatever, whatever the, whatever the
top tier ultra, I don't know, whatever the top tier M1 chip is, has essentially two kind
of separated GPU die areas with an interconnect between them. That's, that's to my knowledge,
never been done before, uh, because of all the, I mean, it's the same issue that caused
micro stuttering and SLI because those GPUs need to have such high speed links between
them in order to, uh, in order to share data in such a way that they can, uh, that they
can operate without micro stutter that it just wasn't, it just hasn't been feasible.
But Apple did it. AMD has a chiplet design that clearly they're confident enough in to
release and RDNA 3 looks pretty good from what we've seen of it so far. So I'm, I'm
excited. A grave PCMR on Twitch says people need to stop bashing AMD GPUs. They're great
and a better value than Nvidia GPUs. Linus, you're hopelessly biased. Hold on. Let me
come back with some great AMD GPUs. One moment please. Okay. Okay. Okay. There are some,
they exist. They exist. I expect it's not actually a joke. I suspect he might actually
bring one back. Um, it's probably going to be really old because we do have like an area
of the storage, which is actually quite close to us, which is like really old school GPUs.
And he's going to have to go back into the vault to pull one of these out. He might have
to dust it off a little bit. I hope we have a brush. Um, but you know, two 90 and two
90 X. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Featured in scrapyard wars. Maybe those will
come up. We'll see. Um, other things to talk about. I think he's going to want to be here
for pretty much everything. Um, and I don't think I have enough time to talk about video
game donkey and his big mode publisher. Uh, but we'll talk about that later. Do you want
a question, Luke? I have one for you. Sure. Let's do it. Last week you shared that you
are scuba certified. Yeah. Have you been anywhere cool or have plans to go anywhere cool? That's
from anon. Sure. Um, I've been to a few places. My favorite one was, uh, green Island in Taiwan,
which it's going to have a different name if you can speak Taiwanese, I guess, but I
know it as green Island. The diving there was absolutely fantastic. Really, really awesome.
There's one place, uh, we went, I don't remember how deep it was. I'm sorry. It's been, it's
been a few years cause we haven't been able to travel. Um, but I used to go to Taiwan
every year, but yeah, the dive brought us through two opposing currents. So as we were
going down, there's one current that went this way. And then there's another current
that this went this way. And then there was a valley between two like underwater mountain
things. And there was reef everywhere and tons of fish. And it was, it was absolutely
beautiful. Loved it. All right. Oh yeah. Okay. Okay. No one saw those. Cause those all went
to, went to mining. Let us not forget. Let us not forget the truly amazing best-selling
product that was, oh man, the, ah, radion Vega 64 water cooled edition. It wasn't even
vaporware at all. Yeah. This product definitely actually existed. I remember, I remember a
whole thing where I was like, I was like, yeah, you know, we've been using a lot of
like Nvidia GPUs in our builds lately. And I went on new egg, like, like mid life cycle
for this product. And I was like, oh yeah, like what's their, what's their like pricing
like? Has it settled in a little bit since launch when it wasn't competitive at all?
And there was literally one vendor that had like one skew for, for Vega 64. And of that
skew, you know how you can just like key in the quantity that you want to buy and it'll
correct you if they don't have enough. They had like three in stock and this was on new
egg.com functionally. These things didn't exist. A big, big F big fail for non-water
cooling exists, but they like all went to miners. That was my understanding. Vega 56
kind of existed, but even for that one, you know, you'd go on new egg.com and they'd have
literally like 25 in stock and on any G four skew individual skew, they would have more
than that in stock to give you some idea of what the sales disparity was. Guys, I don't
make the rules here. I'm just informing you and let it, and let us not forget, let us
not forget the radion seven. I think, I think they actually did make seven of them. I was
going to say, I don't even know if I've seen this. This was a product that as far as anyone
could tell was a data center GPU that they like, I don't know, had some extras of or
something and they did one run of them and then it just quietly fricking disappeared.
Like, okay, are we ever going to, are we ever going to talk about radion seven again? No.
All right. No problem. Guys. Look, I don't know. I don't make this stuff up. This is
just, it's just a reality. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. Um, it's, it, no, I, I'm not, I'm not
a fan boy. I'm just, I've just been doing this a long time. I'm just jaded. I'm jaded
and cynical are nine to 80 really solid. Uh, nine years ago, nine to 80 was a rerelease
of a, of a GPU that they had already released like two years prior. Was it a pretty good
price performance though? Well, yeah, like, uh, you know, nine years ago. Was it nine?
I think it was nine years ago. I know I just said that twice, but I think the R nine to
80 was announced at the Hawaii launch where the only, if I recall correctly, the only
actual new card was the 90 class cards. And then the 80 was just a rebranded 79 70 if
I recall. And then didn't they rebranded again as the three so long. I don't really remember
any of this. I just remember the price performance was pretty solid and people would sell them
used for like nothing. Guy in Matt's I asks, did those fury GPUs exist? That was yet another
essentially vaporware AMD high end GPU. They've released these high end products that have
been not competitive. And then because they're not competitive, nobody's actually buying
them like that. You got the weird like all team red fanboy builds. Yeah. And that's it.
And so you can't get board partner support for them because when you do a run of boards,
like you're talking thousands, tens of thousands, not like a few hundred, you do not build a
few hundred graphics cards. It's not a thing. So it just, why and why would you, why would
you go and buy thousands of something that you know is obsolete before you even build
it other than to just do a favor for AMD? There are exceptions. Yeah. 5,700 XT. Yeah.
Wrong card. Polaris. Yeah. Polaris was solid. Uh, it's so funny to hear people talking about
RX five 80, RX five 80 is RX five 70 or four 80 excuse me. Um, four 70 is four 80 and a
five 70 four 70 is five 70 and four 80 is five 80. They're, they're essentially the
same thing. It's like, it's like a firmware update. Uh, some can says a 79 70 mind me
15 Bitcoins 10 years ago. So Hey, Hey, did you trade those for a pizza or did you actually
hold on to them? Uh, Linus is just focusing on the high end, which they've not done much
within the last few years. Yeah. Cause they couldn't, you don't think they wanted to.
Everyone likes selling high end GPU's. It's a good time. I think the main ones that we've
been talking about today have been a four 80, sorry, 40, 80, 40, 70, 40, 90. So we're
talking about hand cards. Yeah, of course we're talking about high end cards. Um, but
yeah, so I forget why I was talking about AMD. Oh yeah, right. Because I'm actually
hopeful for RDNA three. I'm excited. Uh, it seems like over the last couple of years,
they've really settled down in terms of their driver development. Uh, I still, I really
need to try it. I haven't tried it yet, but apparently their hardware and coding has gotten
a lot better, which is a big one for me. Like AMD and Nvidia, AMD could be 10% better price
to performance than Nvidia. And if they don't have good hardware, age two, six, four encoding,
or I mean failing that AV one is fine. Well, until OBS supports AV one, I guess I don't
care, but until they have solid hardware encoding, I'm just, I, I'm not going to do it because
on the occasion that I do stream, I'm not going to want to suck up CPU cycles. Um, but
if they have it, man, like, what do you stream? I'm excited for a viable alternative. What
do you stream? I've streamed Beat Saber. Yeah. Is that hard to stream? Beat Saber. Well,
yeah. You don't want to suck up CPU cycles when you're in VR. Yeah. It matters more than
you'd think. Cause if I get a stutter, I get sick. That's fair enough. Okay. For real.
And Anno is actually can be actually be pretty heavy once you're far into games. Yeah, exactly.
Yeah. Um, all right. So the discussion already supports AV one encoding. I didn't actually
know that. Sorry. Someone in chat said OBS already supports AV one encoding. Really?
Since OBS 28. Oh, well that's exciting. I didn't know that, but that leads us perfectly
into our discussion question here. So the big winner, this is, I it's in here as like
a question. I added this in my opinion, Intel, because what it looks like is if we look at
last gen games, cause the, the two to four X faster, well that's for next gen games with
like DLSS three and stuff. It does this every single launch gate. Yeah. So when they say
last gen games, we're expecting only one and a half to 1.6 times faster, which means that
your price per FPS looks like it's actually not really changing that much. Essentially
they're taking, they're doing the same thing they did with the, uh, the 20 series where
they're taking the existing lineup and they're basically just going, yeah, however that performed,
we're going to put these new cards higher. Exactly. Exactly. In line with the pricing
of the last generation, instead of accounting for the, they like, I have actually gone down
in cost for them for FPS per dollar, but don't worry about that. Don't worry about that.
So if they do that, I think the big winner is Intel because if they built a product that
was supposed to compete FPS per dollar with 30 series, then it still competes. Then it
might still actually compete. It'll be, it'll be a lower end product than it would have
been in terms of how far away it is from the top of the line in the market. But that doesn't
mean that it won't be a totally valid and relevant product at the price that, you know,
Luke the gamer who doesn't want to get another job so he can buy a GPU can actually afford
big winner potentially Intel. I also like, I don't know. I often have cheaper
tastes on a lot of people, but a 70 series or is a 70, whatever, a 40, 70 starting at
900 is a lot. That's a ton of money. Like I know this is long, long, long time ago,
but weren't we looking at like four like it's over doubled in the last 10 years, right?
Oh yeah. Yeah. Oh yeah. Huge portion, 900 bucks. When you're looking at gaming builds
now, that are pretty solid for the majority of games that people play for like a mid range
gamer that are around the price of your graphics card. Like I helped, I helped a buddy spec
out a computer recently. Didn't have a huge budget. We priced it in and I think about
a thousand or 1100, something like that. Like it's always, it's an okay amount of money.
It's not a massive budget though. It's going to do pretty good. It's pretty darn close
to the price of the entire graphics card and that he's going to be completely fine. He
already has the computer. He is completely fine in like almost everything people play.
Like sure. He's not cranking Star Citizen, but there's like 40 people that play. So that's
a, that's actually not true. They passed 500, $500 million in funding. Yeah. That's in the
land dock. Is it really? Yeah. We'll talk about it. Yeah. Wow. The 8,800 GTX, which
came out in 2004, MSRP 599 US 8,800. And that was the, that was the top tier until they
released a mid cycle refresh 8,800 ultra. That was just an overclocked 8,800 GTX. It
was, it was essentially the same thing. And so we can't really, that was a wicked time.
We can't really compare this to a 4080. And the reason for that is that it's not an apples
to apples die to die comparison. The 8,800 GTX was a 384 bit memory bus, large die part.
So really from like a die area standpoint, the equivalent would be the 4,090. Yeah. Which
is coming in at $1,600, which is somewhere about two. And what does that work out to
about two and a half X the price. Now, if we go and we play, let's play inflation calculator.
All right. Because that's certainly been a thing. Inflation calculator, USD. All right.
Come on, come on, come hang with me. You guys let's play with the USD inflate. So if in
2004, uh, I purchased an item for 599, then in 2002, calculate $939. So it's entirely,
sorry guys. It's entirely, um, believable that you could pay $939 for a top tier GPU
today. That wouldn't seem too surprising. No, that, that wouldn't be, that wouldn't
be that surprising to me at all. So that's the actual price that they've come in with
for the 47, excuse me, sorry. Ah, the 40, 80, 12 gig, which is by the way, like a mainstream
tier part in terms of, of die area. But there's one problem with that argument that Nvidia
is making that, well, semiconductors, uh, electronics are getting more expensive and
that's every other, um, electronics thing. Electronics is like this magic, it like has
inflationary armor or something. Like look at what the cost of a TV is compared to what
it was in 2004. It's actually crazy cheap. It's wild. And, and this isn't, this is another
thing. TVs, TV manufacturers are under a lot of the same pressures that Silicon manufacturers
are. Except there's more competition in their space compared to Mr. GPU team that has no
one against them effectively right now. Exactly. That's the problem. As you try to build bigger
and bigger TVs, the fabs get bigger and more complex. As you try to cram in more pixel
density, you have to deal with far higher complexity, far lower yields. Consumer, consumer
demands have gotten much, much more stringent. People used to accept that you could have
up to five to seven dead pixels pixels. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Now they'll just take it back
one dead pixel. Now you're done. You're done. You're out. You're out. And reliability has
become much more of a challenge. I suspect that LG does more warranty replacement of
their OLED TVs than they probably did of their, the previous technologies that they focused
on just because of the nature of OLED. And if you run it at full brightness all the time
with static imagery, it is going to wear out within the warranty period, which I don't
think was a problem that they necessarily faced before. Yeah. So all, so these other
electronics industries are under a lot of the same pressures and yet it's a very different
result. Yep. I'm very much hoping for other teams. I was already really hoping for Intel
and I know I'm saying this for like the fourth time this show, but the whole chiplet thing
has me stoked for AMD's new offerings as well. We'll see how it goes. One of our other discussion
questions actually, before we wrap this up, and we will soon, but one of our other discussion
questions is how much of this is Nvidia strategy? How much of this is higher pricing so that
they can just get rid of the, of the rumoured enormous stockpile of 30 series cards that
they have sitting there because they overproduced for a mining boom that busted. So like making
it not an improvement in price performance is strategic. Yeah. Cause they'd actually
do not want you to buy 40 series sitting on inventory is expensive. Yeah. So this way
they don't have to mark down their 30 series as much unless AMD sees a moment of weakness,
drops something big and decides to. They've done it before. They've done it before. I'd
like to see it. So here's my idea. I think that following just our, you know, vanilla
review of the RTX 4,000 or whatever, when that comes out, following that, I kind of
want to do a deeper dive into RTX 4,000 versus RTX 3000 plus arc as a dedicated AV1 encoding
coprocessor. And specifically I would want to look at it from like a streaming standpoint.
Yeah. Yeah. I think you'd have to. I think that would be, that would be sick. That'd
be sweet. I have always loved mixed team GPU setups. I remember way back in the day you
did some video in the house about running AMD and Nvidia. I had SLI and crossfire in
the same computer. Like that was cool. That was so stupid. Ridiculous. But it was cool
that it like functioned. Yeah. It was, it was pretty dumb. So the idea was that depending
on whether the game was better optimized for Nvidia or for AMD, you could switch which
primary GPU your monitor was plugged into. Get the best of all worlds. Oh, by the way,
I hope your GPUs don't need to breathe because they're all a solid brick installed in your
PCIE slots. I'm pretty sure we didn't want to cool it. So very cool. But yeah, I don't
know. Hopefully the GPU world gets turned on its head because it's been pretty frustrating
for a while now. CPU was frustrating for a longer period of time and then got solved.
Yeah. Maybe AMD can solve it again. I'd like to see it solved. We also need a solution
to Logitech thinking that their G cloud handheld has any reason for existing. You know, I heard
through the grapevine that some kind of Logitech gaming handheld was coming quite some time
ago. I was going to say it's, it must've been quite some time ago because the planning for
this must've started before they heard about Steam Deck. It must've. It has to.
I did not know that it was going to be a cloud gaming device. Cloud. So that's, that's the
name of the product, which won't get confusing when you're trying to look up information
about it at all. Cloud requires a cloud, but not capitalized. Subscription service sold
separately to work as intended. Holy s**t. Good luck Logitech. Such as Nvidia G force
now or Xbox game pass the specs. Snapdragon 720 G. So fast. G is for G wiz. This sure
is a mainstream tier product. Octa core CPU, 10 ADP. Okay. IPS for 50 nets. Okay. 60 Hertz.
That's battery life. Oh my God. Who worked on this product page? This is the fresh rate.
It's going to be so fresh. Does it say fresh rate? It says fresh rate. That F is capitalized.
It's not cut off. That's awesome. The fresh rate. That is so sick. 60 Hertz yo. You need
another wrapping video. It's been too long. No, I do not. I do not need that. Uh, stereo
speaker. Okay. No, no. It's either a mono speaker or stereo speakers. You cannot have
it both ways. Uh, Bluetooth 5.1 digital USB-C headphone support. Um, that's still analog.
Man. I don't want to be that guy, but come on you guys. It comes with a power adapter
in the box. That's sick. Battery watt hours. Wait, what? Battery. Well, I mean, yes, that
is the unit, but like the unit goes after here and you would just say battery capacity.
You wouldn't say battery grams and then 90 grams. You would really, you guys, they also,
I also enjoy that. Say they say battery watt hours and then they put watt hours again,
but abbreviated in the spec team redundant team. Yeah. There's reviews on the website.
Yeah. I got to read these because it has five stars and let me put it this way. I don't
think if we released this product on lttstore.com it would have five stars because we, assuming
they're not like spam or abusive, do not curate the reviews on our site. Have you looked at
the, was this review helpful ratings? Oh, hold on a second. Floatplane is a float plane
is talking about TF cards. Do they seriously say it has, Oh my God, it has TF card expansion.
When's the last time you heard micro SD called trans flash. Like I think like 2008. I'm not
even kidding. It's been a minute. Yeah. Again, no offense. Like to be clear, I think Logitech
builds a lot of great products. Oh yeah. Love definitely. I have personally received even
going back before, before I was like scary to not give good service to I've received
amazing customer service from Logitech. One of my favorite brands, mad respect for Logitech.
This product page is atrocious chief. Okay. So jump to the reviews or share my screen.
Jump into the reviews. Let's go look at the, was this review helpful section? No brainer
for the new wave in gaming. No Luke, I need to read these. This is a no brainer. I don't
think no brainer means what you think it means. These feel like they were written by a commission
based retail store employee. No brainer because your brain fell out, completely fell out out
through your ear. I was hesitant because of the need for constant wifi, but the world
is only going more and more cloud based. So you've got to get it now. You've got to get
it on the train. Not having RTX. I took a couple of days to really think about it and
realize it's a no brainer applause for Logitech pushing the technology culture forward. That
specific wording I love and looking forward to reviewing this as well. So you didn't review
it. You just want the technology culture pushed forward. Thank you, Cyrus L. All right, next
up we've got Martin. Cyrus, if you don't include something about the technology culture being
pushed forward in your actual review, I'm going to be very disappointed. Logitech got
it right. This is the definitive perfect answer to a gap in the market that leverages unique
opportunities that are booming in the last years. Handheld PC companions and cloud gaming.
Simple offering from Logitech to surf on that product line. Seems with a perfect answer.
Looking forward to see how it has actually been executed. Only question right now. And
then it ends. Uh, okay. No, there's a tiny space after the M that you can click on. Why
no SIM or eSIM slot? Well, because that would be terrible. And then they answered their
own question. Yeah. Oh, but with the huge data consumption of cloud gaming, that would
probably destroy your data plan in two days. Yes, that's it. Also the latency sucks. Like
there's no way you'd want to play on mobile. So whatever employee wrote these added an
FAQ at the end of one of their reviews, which is good. Dylan S says, please release in the
UK, please. And Kevin S, this is my personal favorite. It's American made. Yeah. No, it
isn't. This device is a great new addition to the world of gaming. It has all the features
you could look for in it. Okay. I think we need to examine this wording very closely.
It has all the features that you could look for in it. So if you could look for the feature
in it, then it has it. I don't know if that's true. And finally it does. And I quote everything
right. Okay. Look at the, was this review helpful? Oh yeah. These, these people supposed
people are getting absolutely slayed by the, the thumbs up and thumbs down ratings, which
is very interesting to me because the logitech got everything right by Martin has 65 dislikes.
If there was that many dislikes, you'd think that someone would click the writer review
button and write a negative review, but there is only five star reviews. Yeah. So are they
filtering it so that you can only see, I have an idea. I'm going to write a review. I think
it has to be a five star one to show up, but we'll find out. We'll find out. I'm going
to do a two star because I, you know, I don't want to be overly negative. I'm going to,
I'm going to go with title. Logitech has their work cut out for them to be clear. I don't
want this to be spam, right? Like I'm not, you should never leave a spam review and,
and I'm not going to misrepresent it. I'm not going to act like I own it. I don't think
you need to. So that's okay. But if Logitech's line, okay. If Logitech's line is that you
have to be a verified purchaser, then okay, fair enough. No, it's not. Well, that's exactly
what I'm saying. Yeah. Like if that's the line, then fine. That's where the line is.
But then you need to be consistent. Then the people leaving it five star reviews should
also have their reviews wiped out, right? I think verified reviewer means purchaser.
Yeah. So some of them are, some of them aren't. Yeah, exactly. And, and to be clear, you know,
I'm not saying that, you know, your moderation will be perfect. Like I promise you, there
are reviews on LTT store from people who didn't buy it that are positive that we didn't remove
because usually it's just a case of nobody flagged it to us. Like it wasn't so egregiously
spam that it, that it didn't get flagged. But what that means is that the way our system
works is things go up by default and then are pulled down. So what we're testing right
now is to see if a reasonable balanced review, one where I didn't buy it, but neither did
some of the other people will make it through to their site. So do you want to, do you want
to do another topic or, Oh, do you want to do sponsor spots while I type up my review
and then you'll read it to us when you're done? Sure. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Okay. Okay. Let's go. Let's go. Can you throw sponsors for me? Yeah, go for it. Thanks to
Shadow for sponsoring today's WAN Show. Shadow is a cloud-based PC service, very topical
right now, allowing for power in a scalable and flexible way. Thanks to their gaming background,
Shadow provides an outstanding quality for all design and creative works and helps professionals
reaching their objectives from architects to gaming publishers, or a mixture of both
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is streamed in high quality to the user. The flexibility to add, move, delete various Shadow
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multiple locations or devices, your favorite Mac or any tablet or any basic laptop, like
potentially this one. Shadow will also bring the capability to organize stunning visual
events and demos in a highly secured, flexible and data rich environment. Learn more about
Shadow's business solutions using the link in the description below or the one that's
like roughly here. Next one, Kyokusya! Thanks to Kyokusya for sponsoring this episode of
the WAN Show. Kyokusya didn't just invent flash memory, they continue to innovate in
the space to this day. Their new XG8 series SSD is optimized to give the latest gaming
laptops and pre-built PCs the power and performance they need for the best games today. The XG8
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the way up to 4 terabytes and can be found in a lot of the newest OEM machines. Learn
more about the XG8 SSD from Kyokusya also at the link below or also right there. And
Epidemic Sound! Thanks to Epidemic Sound for sponsoring today's video. Epidemic Sound provides
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that sounds similar to the sound you're looking for. That's actually really, really cool.
So sign up today using the link in the description or again, nope, just in the description for
a free 30 day trial. Psych. Also another one, I'm going to get him a little bit more time.
LTT store deal of the week. Get four elemental shirts for only 50 bucks. The discount is
applied automatically at checkout. You can mix and match at your own will. I believe
you could even get four of the same one if you're into that type of thing. I know a few
people that just like having the same stuff all the time, so you could do that. So check
it out. Yeah. Lttstore.com elemental shirts. They're good quality shirts and four for 50
is a really good price. There's also the LTT cargo shorts. Oh, dang. Yeah. Go buy. I heard
about that earlier, but I didn't know that was actually like a thing. They are. It's
on the store right now. Whoa. Whoa. Cool. We're looking at, uh, I think Riley's junk
right now. Sort of. Sorry, Riley, but you want to share your screen? Yeah. Why not?
That's not it. Hey, there's Riley. Yeah. I don't necessarily know what to say about them,
but they look good. Oh, there's, there's lots of cool things to say about them. Actually.
They have magnetic flaps, but they're like, like, like flat magnets. So they don't like
show a lot. Yeah. You can't really tell. I don't think, I think you can sort of see it
right there, but not really. It looks like a design feature, if anything. Yep. Um, they're
super comfy. Uh, in my opinion, they look great and I like magnets. What else could
I say? Very cool. 2% spandex. So they got a little bit of the stretchy. That's good,
but not, not a ton. You're not going to feel like you're wearing like yoga, yoga shorts
or whatever. Exactly. Exactly. Seven useful pockets. Is there back pockets? Oh man. I
forget. I'm pretty sure I'm pretty sure there's someone's butt in here. Probably. There we
go. There's Riley. Cool. Heck yeah. Right. Lots of different sizes. Get the phone in
there. Oh, that's a good way of showing that off. Yeah. Oh, I love it. Screwdriver bit.
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. There you go. Cool. I worked on these. Oh, is that intentional? It's like
a pocket for headphones. Of course. Very cool. Very cool. It's always intentional. Always
intentional, sir. Sweet. Yeah. Did he throw his t-shirt into cargo shorts? I think he
did. Oh, what a boss. All right. All right. Yeah. He's a winner. All right. So let's go
back to my screen here. He wins the dad games. I have written my review. All right. Let's
hear it. Okay. Well here, we'll just go to me. Score two stars. Title. Logitech has their
work cut out for them. Here's my review. The challenge for Logitech here is not that I
feel there is a lack of demand for a cloud streaming handheld. I look forward to being
hands-on and my expectations for the quality of the control and the display are very high
given Logitech's reputation for building excellent peripherals. However, it feels like this product
was conceptualized and designed at a time when competing gaming handhelds were not yet
available and it's a major problem for Logitech that there are other devices for 50 to a hundred
dollars more that can not only game via cloud services, but also locally due to their much
more powerful hardware. So it may not be bad, but it's awkwardly positioned. At $150, I
could see it making sense, but that would require aggressive cost savings on the bomb.
So that could, on the bomb, comma, which could hurt the experience and make it feel cheap
and ultimately reflect poorly on the Logitech brand. It feels like a device that just doesn't
have a place at the price it costs to build. User name, Linus Sebastian, email, linustechtips.gmail.com,
and we'll go ahead and post. So it looks like that did in fact go up and all that remains
to be seen is whether it stays. Oh no, it didn't. Oh crap. You guys missed this. Mine
went up for a second. Yeah, I never saw it. And then I refreshed and it was gone. Yeah,
it's not there for me. Okay. So what we've confirmed then is that whatever other form
of filtering, either they all have to be manually approved or it's only five star or something.
Whatever other good things that Logitech has done, they are clearly suppressing, um, real
feedback on this product in a way that I'm not like a super huge fan of. Obviously you
don't want spam. There is, there is people will, if you have it completely open, people
will post things that are not okay to have on your website. Um, so like you do need some
form of filtering to be fair. I just find it extremely suspicious that with this much
negative interaction, like the 70 dislikes on one of these reviews, that there are zero
reviews that have any form of real negative content in them or don't rate it five stars.
Yeah, that's super, super, super sus. People are saying the reviews button is gone from
the main page now, so you can't even get to the review page. Really? What? It's there
for me. That doesn't seem right. Yeah, I saw it. I was able to navigate away and I was
able to go to it again. I've even been like, I'm in the process of typing a five star review.
It's amazing that Logitech has seen the future and built this product. It's like they're
looking into my mind and seeing what I want and building it before I can even think of
it. Logitech, thank you for bringing. I didn't know I've been waiting this, waiting for this
my whole life. Oh, thank you for bringing the cloud future to the present. Ah, I only
just now realized I have been waiting for this product my whole life. Use your name
Luke Esquire. Darn it. I'll take it. Okay, let's go. Let's go. Okay. You guys ready?
You guys ready? Let's post. Let's see. Okay. Luke E here. I love this thing. Okay. Refresh.
It's gone and it's gone, so it's gotta be manual, but I can subscribe to Logitech G.
So yeah, it appears to be manual review. Let's see if anyone from Logitech would watch his
WAN show and if they accidentally let the Luke Esquire review through. You guys are
gonna keep an eye on this for us, right? You need to, yeah. I think someone's gonna tip
someone off at Logitech. Oh, probably. Apparently the Canadian site has no review option, but
the US site does. Got it, got it. Okay. Yeah, it's just a bummer. The 64 gig steam deck
is $399 and you can easily look at the 64 gig steam deck and go, yeah, that's not enough
storage as a stupid device. But then the Logitech one doesn't have any storage. Yeah, so you
could have some, some local games. It's better than nothing, which is what it's competing
against at this price point. Like steam deck pricing is wild. Valve basically came in,
slapped their gigantic deck on the table and we're like, yeah, we're just like not going
to make money. So we talked about a lot at the lunch that the, that the deck was very
aggressively priced. I saw people complaining about the pricing. I was like, are you, have
you lost your, your pickles? We've said since the very beginning that the pricing of the
deck was very aggressive. I could see, I could see. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. Logitech's got some
crappy anemic Snapdragon 720 G in here and they still have to put it on $50 promo or
whatever to, to get within, within like a reasonable shot of what a valve is doing with
the deck. Snapdragon 720 G when that come out announced on January 20 in 2020 is here.
Here's the thing. If the deck didn't exist, what would you think of this pricing?
Might be all right. Yeah. Yeah. Cause looking at what windows handhelds from companies that
are not able to subsidize with Steve, 30% steam game revenue, right? Like, uh, I a Neo
has the, uh, the air, which is like what starts at like 650 bucks. So yeah, it costs half
as much, probably like feels pretty good, but only does like cloud streaming. I mean,
I know there's some clouds subscriptions. I don't like them, but there's some clouds
subscriptions that get you a lot of games. Yeah. And there's, there's people who bought
PS Vita's basically exclusively to stream from their PlayStation. That's a thing that
is a use case where they're only even going to use it at home. Right. And if I was only
using this thing at home. Yeah. Yeah. At that price, like I, it would still be one of those
weird curiosity, like in between products to me for sure. But it, but the pricing, if
the deck didn't exist, I would not have been surprised. I wouldn't have said the same thing
that I said about the deck. Like, Whoa, the pricing here is so crazy, blah, blah, blah.
But I would have been like, yeah, I get it. Yeah. It's a screen. It's got a motherboard
in it. They have to pay back the it's probably cost somehow a low volume product. Yeah. Like,
yep. Yeah. A hundred percent. Yeah. I don't know. I'd agree. But in a world where the
deck does exist, this is a little out to lunch, uh, in a world where merge messages exist.
There's a lot of sending super chats and Twitch bits is out to lunch. So you guys, if you
want to, if you want to send a merge message, all you got to do, head over to LTT store
dot com, uh, check out either the elemental t-shirt deal. So we're doing four t-shirts
for 50 us dollars. They're basically the only shirts we have in stock right now because,
um, long story short, we were a not able to get product consistently from American apparel
and B knew that we were not able to get product consistently from American apparel. So we've
been working on our own branded shirts for quite some time. Um, and so we've kind of
allowed our American apparel shirts to kind of go away. Uh, also we launched screwdriver,
which sold like 60,000 units or 50,000 units in the first week or something like that.
So we obviously alongside those orders sold a lot of t-shirts. So there's like, it's a,
it's a t-shirt wasteland on the site except for good old elemental, our worst selling
design, except when we do promos for elemental, you know, what's really funny is like a lot
of mornings I actually grabbed the elemental shirt. Just like, yeah, they're solid. It's,
it's just as, it's the same blank. So it's just as comfy as all the other ones. Yep.
And it's just just simple LTT logo. We've got four different colors. So guys check them
out. You can get four elemental shirts. And so it works out to like $13 each or something
like that. Um, like less than that, like 1250 each or something. And then we also obviously
launched cargo shorts. So either your message will show down here if you want to do like
a shout out for your mom or your friends, if assuming your mom and your friends watch
when show, I mean, I don't know. My mom does. Yeah. Hey, there you go. So you can do a shout
out or you can, uh, uh, ask a simple question and our producer Jake Bellavance can answer.
Oh, uh, the producer cam is not pointed at you, Jake. Good. So you can't sneak up on
me. Oh, did you do that on purpose? Anyway. So a bell might answer you and then your answer
will show up down there. Or if you have like a more complicated thing, then he might throw
it to us. Uh, so you just, uh, go, you can look in the checkout on lttstore.com. You'll
see a field to fill out. So that's what we do instead of super chats instead of, um,
like Twitch, whatever, probably ever people throw money at people on Twitch. All right.
What did you want to talk about next? Um, Oh yeah. And we're going to, we'll, we'll
answer super chats, super chat, dang it. We'll answer merchant at the end of the show. Wow.
So people had complained about there being too much merge messages interspersed. I want
to know more about this Linus tech tips, Español. Oh, this is so exciting. Cause I, I, I heard
grapevine stuff about this in the past, but I didn't know this was actually like happening
now. Oh yes. So Ed has been, uh, putting some serious business work into LTT on Español
and let's go ahead. I'm sorry. I do not speak Spanish. I don't even pretend to speak any
Spanish. So my accent is surely atrocious, but let's go ahead and pop this bad boy up
here. I believe my audio should be working, but, or here, I'll walk you through what you're
about to see first and then I'll show it to you. We're taking the original video. Okay.
So in this case it's a clip from, uh, I forget which one, but it doesn't matter. The point
is this is a very, very short video clip, but we've actually done it on a much, much
longer video and it does scale. I believe the video that you're going to see it come
out on first is the dash cam video that we did recently. And what it, what we're doing
is we are using, uh, like a, like a voice to text service to transcribe the input audio
to English. So then we get an English version of the script. Then obviously there needs
to be a little bit of cleanup. We are then taking that English text and using like AI
natural language translation to translate it into Spanish text, which is all like, yeah.
And right, like you've been able to use Google translate to do that for an awful long time
at this point. Okay. Now here's where things get really wild. Next stage is a text to speech,
um, with an AI generated voice that not only creates the voice from absolutely nothing,
but attempts to handle the timing of the delivery. Okay. I, so I still think that has problems
with, uh, emotion, right? Uh, it tries. Okay. Wow. It tries, but, um, it's, it's tough.
So the next stage, hold on a second. Is this the one where he sent it? Yeah, cool. So you
can watch along with us if you want, because I have this right here. So you can just take
that and then you can watch while we're watching. Maybe just turn your audio on away from that.
Not yet though. Not yet. So after we create the AI generated voice version, the robot
voice gets naturalized with AI into a recording from a voice actor's voice, like into, into
an another voice that's based on a recording from a voice actor, but that's just like a
voice print. Okay. So it's not a voice actor who read the script. No, there's no voice
actor involved at any stage in this process. Then this is wild. After the whole process
is done, we find any sentences where the timing of the delivery is not quite right. Um, you
know, with like a, you know, you're going to see in this, there's like a punch in and
so the delivery is like kind of timed weird and we can spot fix it ourselves by just yakking
into a microphone. Like the editor could just like do their best Spanish impression at their
desk and then it would, we'd use the same AI voice editing process to turn instead of
the robot voice into the actor's voice, our editor's voice into the actor's voice for
hopelessly, hopelessly, hopefully a seamless viewing experience. Now all that sounds pie
in the sky. Sure does. Um, loud face. Bob says this seems incredibly overcomplicated.
Well, what else? How else would you do it? You'd have to hire someone. Yeah, you'd have
to hire it. Like I can tell you right now, managing a team of translators and voice actors
also complicated. Like, yes, it's complicated, but what it also could be is scalable. Um,
and yes, cleanup is required in the translation as well. So this sounds like it's going to
be a disaster, says Squid Vorb. All right. Um, you guys ready? Yeah. Okay. Uh, hopefully
you guys have my audio here, but you're going to see each step that I just described one
after the other after the other. Uh, so ready Luke, why don't we press go at the same time
here? Do you have audio? Double check. That's probably adjusting ringer volume. Oh no, you're
okay. Three, two, one. Let's go. Oh, people are saying they can't hear it. Bella. I thought
we checked this. Uh, I heard it. Get wrecked audience. Um, I see, I see levels. So what's
the deal with that? I thought we, yeah, we have no, can you check the OBS advanced audio
properties or whatever and make sure it's actually taking that source. Sorry guys. I
mean, I guess we've kind of spoiled it a bit now. It was supposed to be all impressive
and stuff. I want to like talk about it, but I need to, I'm going to not until you guys
can see it as well. I know. I know. Right. Then we can discuss it together. Yeah. Sweet.
Should we be saying it was very quiet. Oh, like it was picked up by Mike. Yeah. Yeah.
That was probably, that was probably Luke. Yeah. Yep. Now it probably was just picked
up. Failing, failing, uh, getting this working properly. I'll just hold that up to the microphone
and we'll call it a day. Um, don't want me to read our merge message. Sure. Yeah. Why
don't we do a mark merge message? Well, Bell's tries to figure out what's going on with that
audio source. Uh, Hey, Lance and Luke, first time, uh, sending a message. It's 3m in the
Netherlands. GPU prices are still high here, but CPUs are fine. 30 eighties are still over
a grant. Why do you think this is? And do you think it'll improve? Uh, I think it is
probably for a combination of reasons. It could be old stock that retailers paid that
much for and are clinging to hope that they can get recoup their investment. Retailers
all kind of being like, Hey, you want to not lower? Yeah, cool. That's not too surprising.
That would totally make sense to me. I would check the use market. That kind of collusion
is technically illegal in like basically every developed country around the world, but absolutely
happens, but absolutely happens. Um, I would say that it's possible that, you know, given
the Netherlands is a relatively small market, it's, um, it's possible that the allocations
of GPUs just weren't as high in that region. So there's not as much overstock pressure
on pricing, just not driving it down. I would say that if I was trying to protect the profits
in my region, I would be doing my utmost to keep additional stock from flooding in. Um,
it's also possible that there's not a, I don't know, I'm just guessing it's possible. There's
not a huge mining community there. So maybe, maybe the secondary market isn't being flooded
with GPUs right now. Like it is in other regions like China and the U S and so again, that's
another potential source of pressure on pricing that might not exist there. And those are,
those are the main reasons that I can, that I can think of.
Uh, there's another one. Hey Linus patiently waiting for party shirts to come back in stock.
Smiley face having recently switched to the ASUS PG42UQ, any complaints or issues like
image ghosting? Uh, are they windows snap productivity friendly? Thanks.
All right. Well, two parts of that. One is ghosting. Heck no. Uh, it's a really nice
display. Really liking it so far as for arrow snap or what is it called now? Windows snap,
uh, friendly. I mean, it's an OLED. I haven't owned it long enough to tell you with certainty
that it will not burn in in any way along those lines. Um, hopefully it won't. Yeah,
really. But I mean, I, yeah, I don't know what, I don't know what to tell you. If it
was, if I had to, if I had to buy it and I really had the longevity of the product as
a central concern in my purchase decision, it would give me pause. I'll say that much
Linus, did you notice any significant spikes on either the store or your own traffic on
YouTube with the MKBHD collab? Also, is there anything else you are acquiring for the lab
that you are Uber excited about? Oh, uh, yeah, sure. I mean, first of all,
yeah, of course there was definitely, definitely an increase in traffic to the store from the,
uh, from the Marquez video. I, I don't know that it was like, you know, it wasn't like
a giant spike like we saw when Project Farms review went out, but I think that it's also
a really different type of media. For sure.
Project Farms video was hyper-focused and you know, it's, people watch a video like
that when their purchase intent is like here, they are buying a screwdriver, they are shopping.
Whereas someone watching Marquez build a computer, well that person might not buy a screwdriver
for six months and they might go, I need a screwdriver. Oh yeah, I saw that one.
That type of, that type of situation is more like, um, you're trying to get it in the,
in the mind space of these people so that when they do buy one, they would think about
it. Uh, instead of the Project Farm one where it's like, they're probably going to buy one,
uh, and they might do it now considering they're watching that video.
Yep. I mean, here it's the, it's a classic, it's the classic, it's the sales funnel. Okay.
This is like business, business basics right here. Let's bring this up. Yeah, here we go.
I think pizza's arriving. Hey, thanks. Why is there pizza? Why are you still here? What
a guy. You went to Costco. This is Costco pizza. Oh wow. Thanks. Thanks for the pizza
man. I'm not going to say, I'm not going to say no man. And you've improved the beauty
of the WAN show like tenfold. Okay. Are you having a pizza? Oh, no. He's thinking about
it. He's not doing it. Okay. Well I'll have two pizzas then. I'm going to have his. Thank
you. That works. Yeah. Uh, there was another part of that too, which was, uh, is there
anything else you're acquiring for the lab that you're Uber excited about and he's eating?
Um, okay. Well I can do a different one. We can come back to that. Can you think of anything
acquiring for the lab? So it would have to be like we're developing. I think it doesn't
really matter. Developing for sure. Yeah. Let's talk about some stuff. Uh, we have a,
we have a mission. We've talked about this on the show before, but we have a machine
learning computer vision developer coming on staff, which this might sound kind of lame,
but one of the reasons why I'm really excited about that is because one of our other developers
who's been spending a lot of time doing that and is good at that and has experience in
that will be able to spend more time working on the mobile testing stuff. Yeah. So here's
something really cool that is right in line with that is we are going to be getting our
hands not only on an anechoic chamber for like noise isolation, but we're going to be
getting an RF chamber that will, um, that will eliminate RF bounces. And what that will
allow us to do is objectively determine a band by band. So we'll be able to tell you
carrier by carrier, which phones have the best reception, which is something that is
otherwise. I mean, I think everyone's basically given up on even trying to talk about reception
of cell phones and reviews, because unless you have accounts with every carrier in every
major city, what are you, what do you even, how do you even have that conversation? Right?
Like how do you even test it? Then there's so many real world variables, but what we'll
be able to do is we'll be able to set up our own and turns out you are allowed to do this.
We'll be able to set up our own access points and we will be able to run them at whatever
in whatever bands we want. Yeah, I know. Right. No, we just inside the chamber. Okay. Yeah,
I know. I know. I know. I know, but I'm still kind of surprised, but sure. It sounds good.
Yeah. It turns out we are allowed to do that. And so we will be able to tell you guys objectively
which phones have the best RF reception. Cool. So yeah. Isn't that awesome? Uh, we also apparently,
um, already have on order slash all the materials and we're going to build it. I can't remember.
Uh, but we're working on like an immersion tank so that we can, it's like a water column.
And so we'll be able to immerse devices for their rated depth for their rated amount of
time and see if they survive. Um, yeah, that's cool. I just, I'm, I'm happy the dev team
is expanding. There's also, uh, the backend developer that is, you know, relatively actually
quite high end position where they were working before and had a vacation planned. So there's
a bunch of time buffer there before they were able to join. They're joining soon as well.
So work on the website is going to start. Um, so yeah, I don't know. That stuff's exciting.
While you chew, I'm going to move on to the next question, uh, which I can talk about.
I'm sure you'll have input as well though. Do you, this is from Joseph L. Do you see
cloud computing eventually phasing out the need for powerful personal computers, especially
with rising costs of new hardware? My AI professor thinks it's going to happen real soon. Um,
I don't, I don't think it's going to happen real soon. Uh, for the same reason that we
were when we were just talking about the Logitech G cloud. Um, and it was like, Oh, what do
you think about this? Having ease him and stuff. Yeah. There's like power outages and,
uh, service availability issues. Um, I was just in America for four days. You guys, the
internet sucks. Um, so I wouldn't necessarily want to be at least where I was, it sure did.
So I wouldn't necessarily want to be on a computer that at my current job and at very
likely many of yours, uh, being consistently connected is required. Like I can't, if there's,
if there's a internet problem, if there's an internet outage, my computer can't just
stop working. Like, yeah, I might be limited in what I can do because I don't have the
internet. Um, but it shouldn't just like end everything and taking a computer that can,
that is powerful person, you know, powerful personal computers would have said taking
that and hotspotting it and limiting what you necessarily, maybe, maybe don't listen
to streaming music while you're working for that amount of time or something, but you
can still function because a lot of it's happening locally is great. And with cloud computing,
that's not so much of a thing. Yep. And I mean, there's going to be, I feel like we're,
we're headed towards a, an increase in awareness of the fact that you just, you, nothing is
permanent anymore. Um, very recently project cars too. In fact, it might've been today
project cars too, got delisted from steam. And the reason for that is not that they don't
want to sell the game anymore or not that steam is just tired of having it on their
servers. It's that the licenses for the cars in the game have expired and I guess it's
not selling well enough to justify renewing it and the, or, or for the developer to go
in and tweak all the names and tweak the appearances a little bit or like kind of remove those,
those assets. And so now it's just gone unless you own it already and there's no way to acquire
it anymore because it cannot be properly licensed for acquisition, um, because there are no
physical copies. So you can't buy it secondhand anymore. And I think, you know, if you think
about like a, like a workstation where your hardware itself is a subscription service,
um, you are at the mercy of forces that you cannot control. And in the case of most users
do not fully understand to make sure that you have the tools you need to do your job.
I mean, and especially with, okay, yes, at the high end, it's gotten ridiculous, but
with the affordability of personal hardware at the low to mid range, that's what you're
competing against. That's exactly the problem with the Logitech G cloud or whatever you're
going to have to make a cloud working station that is so much cheaper than just having your
own computer, that it becomes worth it. But having your own computer is so cheap. Yeah.
So it's tough. So these lines are going to have a hard time crossing. Um, I don't know.
I don't personally think your AI professor is correct, but, uh, I don't know. Hold on.
I think there are industries and there are spaces. Oh, it's going to be a thing where
that will happen faster. It's already a thing. Like, I don't think once we could get it down
to like one frame of latency and if we could get the quality a bit better, I don't see
any reason why, uh, like a video editing workstation couldn't be cloud-based. Then north to deal
with updating stuff. So another development station, no, cause if your internet goes out,
another argument I'd throw out there, I don't know, is I was working on a laptop this week.
Um, and I, it was kept in very nice condition. Like the person who owned it very clearly
cared about it. So I didn't actually realize how old it was. There was a, there was a little,
uh, windows. What was it? Windows seven or windows eight sticker on it had a 4,000 series
Intel processor. I didn't even notice because I wasn't gaming on it. All I did was like
document browsing, internet browsing, stuff like that. And it was completely fine. You
know how much that laptop would cost? Like nothing. Yeah. You can get laptops on eBay
for literally like 60 to $70. And you know what? The battery life probably not great
anymore, but if all you need to do, we actually have a video coming up on Chrome OS flex.
And so we talk about like how, um, how tough it is to justify a brand new Chromebook when
you can buy an ancient ThinkPad, put Chrome OS flex on it and let's go. Yeah. Yeah. Right.
I don't know if there's news about the, Oh, there is. There is news about this, the framework
thing. Yeah. Cool. Right. Yeah. It's interesting. Not that it would be easy to justify buying
a framework laptop with Chrome OS now that you have Chrome OS flex. Well, we'll get into
that in a little bit more detail later, but for now I wanted to show you guys the sales
funnel. This is what I was talking about. So I feel like Marquez's video is up here.
Awareness of a company and or its offerings. Um, maybe somewhere in interest in the company
and its offerings. Whereas project pharma is down here, evaluation of whether the company's
offering satisfy one's needs. And then, um, you know, this is really, you know, at the
product page level. So when you're marketing, you have to decide what you're targeting and
your approach is really different depending on what it is. I'm expecting the Marquez video
to result in a very slow burn of sales. I know. I'll say, I'll say now we know we have
not gotten an ROI on it at this point in time, but that doesn't mean that like I'm mad or
that I think it was bad or anything like that. I think it just is a different, it had a different
goal from the outset. So you have to, you have to adjust your expectations accordingly.
Like the backup pop up, we lost a ton of money. Oh yeah. But that wasn't the point. The point
wasn't to make money. The point was to get enough people there that we could get real
user reviews up on the site so that we could launch sales for pre-orders, uh, excuse me,
back orders. That's the distinction. Once we had sold them, they're now back orders,
um, so that we could take back orders for the rest of the inventory that we had coming
in. Um, bell, are we able to come full circle back around to our, uh, Linus tech tips on
Espanola? Do you think you have the audio figured out?
I don't know what's wrong, so maybe it'll work this time. I've checked and rechecked
everything and it in theory should work. Okay. Well why don't we, why don't we give it another
shot here and uh, we'll see what happens. Nope. All right.
Phone time. Well, that's a little frustrating. Yeah. Let's just do that. Unfortunately, you're
not going to get a hundred percent of the experience through the phone. Uh, you're really
not. Part of the experience is visual, uh, which I'll talk about afterwards. No, no.
I'm going to play this and I'm going to try and time it so that they're going at the same
time. Okay. So we'll try. We'll try. But then also obviously like sound quality problems,
stuff like that. I know. I know. We're just going to have to do our best. Just keep that
in mind. Yup. So weird. So weird. Okay. Ready? Here we go. Uh, hold up by the screen. Okay.
We're going to, we're going to try it. We're going to try it. We're going to try it. Okay.
You are as good as debt.
So you guys, uh, you guys got to see it kind of go through all the different stages. And
I mean, to be clear, I don't speak Spanish, but we do have someone on the team who does
and her evaluation of both the, uh, the translation from the English transcript to the Spanish
transcript as well as the, um, the, the, the spoken version of it was that it was pretty
darn good was, was what she said. Yeah. Um, people will be darn disappointed when people,
when they realize Linus speaks zero Spanish. Uh, yeah. Yeah. So people are saying, yeah,
it sounds a little funny, but understandable. Uh, you could still hear the editor's voice
in the last one. Um, it's because he doesn't speak Spanish at all. That was just ed like
using his voice for the pickup. And then it's a different trainer, I think. Yeah. Yeah.
Yeah. It's cool though. Right. That's sweet. That's really cool. Yeah. I'm, um, I'm pretty
pretty shocked. Um, the browser tab was not muted because OBS was seeing, yeah, I had,
I was seeing levels on the display of like, I can't explain it. We have something set
oddly in OBS. Yeah. Bye. See you later. Thanks for the pizza. I prime. All right. Uh, do
we have another topic we wanted to move into? We sure do. We got a few of them. Um, Ooh,
we should talk about the big change in, Oh, I don't know. You know what? No, you pick
one cause I'm, Oh man, what a bad week for Twitch. There's a lot of things going on.
We're talking about Twitch. You want to walk us through a Twitch thing? Sure. I actually
didn't know the thing that's in the doc was happening. Uh, I saw this when I came in today.
There's a lot happening with Twitch right now. Um, but this thing is that Twitch announces
revenue splitting changes and apparently no one's happy. Uh, on Wednesday, the 21st Twitch
started notifying some streamers about incoming changes or upcoming changes to their user
agreements. Uh, Twitch uses a baseline revenue share of 50 50 on net revenue from subscriptions.
I was just going to say this, but it's in the notes. I'll just read it from the notes
behind the scenes. Twitch also offered agreements with premium subscription terms to select
larger streamers. A lot of larger streamers I'm inserting this bit. We're on 70 30 for
a long time. That's not a new thing. And that's been known. That's been relatively publicly
known because of leaks for many years. Um, these premium subscription terms are, yeah,
are common knowledge within the streamer community, but there's no framework in place to determine
which streamers would be offered these premium terms or when to offer them. That is a hundred
percent true. The decision was made over a year ago to stop offering these premium terms.
Do we have premium terms? Did we ever for flow plane? No, for Twitch. No, I obviously
we like get the money from float plane. Uh, I don't think we did. Okay. Yeah. I just wasn't
sure. I have no idea though. All I really cared about the contract back in the day was
like, what does it not let us do? Which wasn't much. So it was like, cool. Um, decision was
made over a year ago to stop offering these premium terms Twitch felt they were not transparent
or consistent in awarding them. That's probably true. Uh, streamers already with these terms
will keep them, but 70 30 split for the first 100 K and a 50 50 split for all revenue generated
after 100 K. Hmm. Hmm. Oh, seems like streaming is expensive and Amazon wants Twitch to actually
make money for once. And that's going to be hard. Not going to work. Hmm. Interesting.
Twitch says 90%, roughly 90% of streamers with premium terms are unaffected because,
you know, they don't make over a hundred K for the 10% recent bump in advertising revenue
share up from 55% for what up to for the 10%. Okay. I get it. I get it. I read it wrong
for the 10% remaining after that 90%. Uh, the recent, a recent revenue bump in advertising
revenue share up to 55% is a great way for these larger streamers to make up most, if
not all of that revenue, a great way that's, that's inserted from Twitch, just to be very
clear because no one likes ads more than 22,000 streamers requested that all streamers be
moved to the 70 30 split and pay streamers faster. Uh, it sounds like that's probably
22,000 streamers that didn't already have the 70 30 split, uh, Twitch responded by making
the in quotes largest change to payouts in years. And they lowered the payment threshold
from a hundred dollars to $50. That is actually really intense because there's going to be
a really large amount of people that stream in order to make 50 bucks for tax reasons
that I'm not going to go into in further detail. Really? Cause I'm super curious. Is it something
you really can't talk about? If you make money off it, it could technically be a business
and things that show up on it could be used against taxes. Oh, so as long as you get some
kind of pay, you have to get some kind of payout. That payout was a hundred dollars.
Now it's 50. That's way easier to do. And if you want to be shady about it, you can
just pay the 50 in yourself. You're going to get 50% of it back. So it's $25.
To be a business. So your gaming computer. Yes. Business expense. Whatever you show on
stream. What if you do more expensive things? We are not accountants. We are not lawyers.
I'm not saying you should do this. We're not. What I'm saying is that it's been done by
people. It has not been done by me. Allegedly. Allegedly. It's been done by people. It's
like super sketch, but I knew it was being done at a hundred and I know it's going to
be a whole heck of a lot easier to do at 50. That's all. Okay. Twitch justified not increasing
to 70 30 by stating that a streamer with 100 concurrent viewers who streams for 200 hours
a month costs the company a thousand dollars over those 200 hours. Yeah. And they're the
ones that make all the tech and host the servers. Streaming is expensive, man. Okay. As hilarious
as part of these changes, Twitch, I'm actually surprised it's like even that low to be completely
honest. And I think that is because they make all the tech and I guarantee that that does
not include developer time for maintaining these things and stuff like that. But anyways
as part of these changes, Twitch is also cracking down on streams that promote certain types
of gambling starting out starting October 18th. I think this is cool. I've never liked
gambling my entire life though. I don't, I don't know. Slots, roulette or dice games
that aren't in the, that aren't in the US or other jurisdictions that provide sufficient
consumer protection are banned. Okay. Prior to this prominent streamers were publicly
considering a Twitch blackout to protest the site's implicit promotion of damaging and
addictive gambling behavior. It's pretty intense. There's a lot of it. With that said sports
gambling not banned. But yeah, because Twitch and the NFL are friends. And in, I think relatively
based on the overall length of the NFL, the NFL being cool with gambling is actually relatively
new as well. But they do seem to be quite cool with gambling these days. So that's a
thing. Poker also remains unbanned. I think because to a decent amount of people it seemed
more like a sport than other forms of gambling. I can see that. Yeah. Which does actually
sort of make sense to me. It's playing sports for money, but that's also gambling, but also
playing the game. It's, I can see. Poker I'd see as kind of a weird gray area. Yeah. Where
there's at least a skill component. Yeah. Like, like I'm not knocking like poker players.
Like yes, there's a skill component, but you also can't deny that there is a chance component.
If I try to play poker against someone who's super good at it, I'm probably going to get
attacked. Yeah. There's more to it than just chance, but there is a lot of chance. Discussion
question. Is this enough or should streamers continue to push for full gambling ban? Oh,
it's just about the gambling ban. I don't know. I'm not into gambling, but I also have
to understand that that's a personal preference thing. I'm not going to watch gambling content.
I'm not going to get influenced by gambling content. If Twitch actually had a meaningful
way to, um, to keep miners off the site, which they don't because it's as far as I can tell,
like no one does all kids watching you like take IDs. Yeah. Um, unless they, unless they
have a way to do that, I think gambling has been pretty clearly set as an adult activity.
And I, I don't really see why we're drawing a line between, Oh, well this kind of gambling
and this kind of gambling, uh, when we know that such a large, large, uh, percentage of
the Twitch viewer community is sub age of majority. So that's my, my biggest issue with
it. Um, you know, beyond that, as far as I'm concerned, you want to stream yourself? Like
uh, I don't, I don't, I don't know. You flip a coin and if it's heads, you, you know, shoot
a paintball at your head and if it's tails, you shoot a paintball at your ass and you
pay 10 bucks. Like I don't, I don't care. I might watch that. I would watch that if
it was you. I would a hundred percent watch that. I would probably pay the stream money.
I'm just saying like, yeah. And you know, the Twitch chat, you know, being all dialed
into Twitch and stuff, they're like, yeah, what about loot boxes? Yeah. A hundred percent.
Yeah. And there's actually this one in full plain chat mentioned, uh, opening Pokemon
cards, Red Dead Redemption 2 and GTA online in GTA online. If you go to the casino, do
you get banned in Red Dead Redemption 2? They have, they have poker. I think they also have
other card game things like do you get banned if you play? Well, it's poker. So no, but
like you can extrapolate from there. For me, the bigger conversation is the revenue
split changes. Yes. That is especially in light of, uh, how, how aggressively YouTube
has pursued. I think I remember saying like back when YouTube was like, yeah, YouTube
gaming. Um, I remember saying like, good luck with that YouTube, but like, I mean, it's
been a long time. Yeah. And I feel like they've only really been picking up a ton of steam
within the last one to two years, but I mean, that's Google, right? But they are picking
up steam long game, long game, long game. I mean, I was that they're winning in the
way that mixer couldn't when mixer did their big move. I remember talking to Wancho about
how it wasn't enough. Yeah. Their move wasn't enough. They didn't bring over enough streamers
and what YouTube streaming is really winning at right now is sure. They're paying to bring
some streamers over. There's also streamers just coming on over the app and not a small
amount of them and not just tiny ones that cost a thousand dollars a month for them to
sustain them. Yeah. Cause there's an army of those I'm sure because they'll see their
favorite streamer move over. So they'll move over too, which is, that's completely fine.
But we're talking like really big streamers that are either approaching YouTube and then
doing it for a lower amount than YouTube might've expected or approaching YouTube and doing
it for nothing, maybe a little bit of seed money to make a cool video where they pick
a purple, they pick a red object over a purple object. Cause that's what happens every single
time. I can, I can definitely see YouTube pushing hard. The Michuski in Twitch chat
says, I heard Ludwig is working with YouTube and BTTV and seven TV extensions. That's that's
pretty interesting. Cause I mean, there's no, there's no doubt that YouTube does not
have feature parody with Twitch yet, but Ludwig's chat thing. It's a matter of time is really
cool though. Like they've actually put in, put in work. I've looked into the developer
behind it. He's doing cool stuff. I finally met him. Oh, Ludwig. Yeah. Yeah. He was at
the thing I'm assuming. Yeah. Cool. Yeah. Super cool. He asked me if after you get a
vasectomy you can still come. And so I explained. That sounds like a question he would ask.
I explained how it works. This is why I like the podcast. Yeah. Yeah. Yep. He's knowledgeable
about a lot of things. Just not that vasectomy, but now maybe he is right. Yeah. Ever expanding.
Oh, well now he's an expert because I actually, I gave him the full lowdown. Yeah. Perfect.
Lowdown pun intended. Did you tell him about how like the doctor recognized you and everything?
No, I didn't talk about that. Cause he might need to know that. He doesn't now. Yeah. I
didn't. I actually forgot about that. That'll be a fun experience. To be honest with you.
Probably hear about it on the yard. Yep. All right. Well I have to, yeah, I don't know.
The revenue split stuff sucks. Oh my God, Twitch chat. Well, can you? Don't leave us
hanging. Yes. Carry on. Yeah. The revenue split stuff, as a creator, having, especially
a streamer, a streamer who hasn't done the proper, I talked about this a few when, when
shows ago, but a streamer who hasn't done the split out into having a heavy arm for
VOD as well. Cause a lot of streamers have been doing that. I think that's actually really
fascinating if you want to look into that. It's very interesting. Um, but streamers who
are just streamers, they, they, they, in a lot of cases don't even have a huge Twitter
presence. They're just, they're streamers. They're on Twitch. That's what they do. Having
your revenue split changed on you is very died. My stream deck stopped working, but
I press a bleep button. It's very uncomfortable with a F word in the middle of there. Like
holy, that's not cool. That shakes your trust. Absolutely. And that's going to inspire you
to reach out and spread out, start doing other things. These people are many people affected
this by this. They're going to start looking into those other streamers, other creators
that have started branching out into other things. I'm going to start doing the dumb
thing and I need to the dumb thing from Twitch's standpoint is that they basically took their
most profitable users, their most profitable users and pissed them off. Yep. Oh, daddy.
Amazon's knocking. You got to start making money. Daddy, Jeff, bandwidth's expensive.
Oh man. This is just so expensive. So dumb. So good luck with that. In other news, framework
partnered with Google for a framework laptop Chromebook edition. This is cool. It'll be
available in early December, starting at a thousand dollars. That's a lot for a Chromebook.
It is the base specs are core I five 12. It says 1240 P, but I'm pretty sure that means
12, 400 P. I don't know. Don't quote me on that. Eight gigs, DDR four, 256 gig NVMe SSD,
13 and a half inch aspect ratio, 13 and a half inch three did by two aspect ratio, 2256
by 1504 resolution display. I can have up to 64 gigs of Ram and a one terabyte SSD because
of course it can. It's a framework and it's got the same milled aluminum chassis, 10 ADP
webcam, 55 watt hour battery, all that good stuff. And the same modules and expansion
cards as for any other framework laptop. The main board in the Chromebook edition is specifically
designed for Chrome OS though, and there's no word yet on windows compatibility. Framework
Chromebooks will get up to eight years of Chromebook iOS updates, but a main board upgrade
from framework could extend that timeline. Pre-orders are available now for a fully refundable
hundred dollars full disclosure. I am an investor in framework. With that said, I think you
guys probably pretty clearly picked up on that. I think a thousand dollars for a Chromebook
is a lot of money regardless of how repairable or how invested I am in the company. So I'll
let Luke do the color commentary on this one.
Just the discussion question. That's it. I don't know. Sure. Just what do you think?
I'm not super into Chromebooks already. Then this is not the framework that I would buy,
but I have already heard from people that want to buy it. And we're really excited that
framework has a Chromebook option now, which I don't personally a hundred percent understand,
but that's cool. Sweet. More options is not bad. I'm excited that framework is expanding
and doing more things. Blah X nine says, if we want to save LTT money, should we watch
on Twitch or YouTube? No. If you have a float plane subscription, you should watch on float
plane. Yeah. You're already, you're paying somewhere between five and $10 a month, assuming
you're not one of the grandfathered in $3 subscriptions. And that's fine. Like that's
we want to use the platform. We're profitable at those kinds of rates where you run into
trouble is when it's ad supported because ads pay like nothing compared to actual subscribed
users. Like we've got 30,000 float plane subscribers now, which is absolutely wild. You guys are
amazing. Um, and the last thing we would want is for you guys to not enjoy the better audio
quality on float plane. If you're going to have to listen to us talk for like three hours,
you should get what you're paying for. Yeah. Stick around, stick around. Also the chat's
way better. Um, I had a good question though, from float plane chat, actually float plane
chat has been slightly less deplorable than usual. Uh, your boy hot pocket asks, so what's
the solution for Twitch? If they need more money, better to take a piece from the top
percent than the streamers who made considerably less. Yeah. So that's what I was actually
going to go into is like, yes, it's extremely uncomfortable, but when daddy Amazon is knocking
saying you need to make money, their rates are unsustainable. They have to do something,
but this, it, it's just, it always happens. Yeah. It's like we've had this, we've had
this conversation with so many creators talking about coming over on foot plane where they'll
be like, well, Patrion has a better revenue split or insert platform here has a better
revenue split. And we're like, okay, well see how that works out for you because we
know what it costs. And at some point, at some point the investors are going to come
knocking and they can't just keep dumping money into it. Why do you think YouTube has
so many fucking ads and the whole name and like, why do you think they're pushing premium
so hard? Yeah. And luckily premium is actually pretty good. Like I said, yeah. And the fact
that you have like music as part of it is like what justifies it for me. If the music
wasn't there, I wouldn't do easily. Yeah. Yeah. But yeah, I don't know. It's, um, it's
tough, but the, the, the idea behind the name of flow plane, which is not something that
we like put on the site and whatnot, cause it's not good for advertising, but it's good
internally, I guess the whole idea behind it is, you know, what a flow plane is, sea
plane, whatever the concept is, it might not take off, but it definitely won't sink. So
from the very beginning and the whole time through we've kept in our minds, we need to
make sure that what we're doing is sustainable. And there was a big question from a bunch
of creators when they were first joining because YouTube paid channels, which is different
than memberships, YouTube paid channels, uh, went up in smoke exactly one year, exactly
to the day, which was very interesting. One year after vessel went up in smoke. So a lot
of creators around the beginning were asking, are you guys going to be able to survive for
a long time? Hello? Yes, we did. Um, but we should go back and respond. Remember when
I pitched you the concept of having like a wall of hate where we would like frame, we
would frame people's comments about how float plane was doomed and going to shut down and
Luke would be unemployed in a year and like all that stuff. And I had pitched like doing
an entire wall plastered and all those stupid comments. I think I have some of them, but
then I should have done it. But, uh, but yeah, we're still here because we've, we've tried
to build it sustainably. And in some ways that does, sure. That does make it less attractive.
It makes it a little bit less competitive. It makes it slower to develop. Yep. But that's
a lot of things. Stuff like this happens on Twitch and stuff like this has never happened
with us. And we're like, well, we're actually trying, I'm making no commitments and I'm
making no commitments on timeline or anything like that, but we're trying to bring our rates
and stuff down to go the other direction than what they're doing. Yeah. Well, I mean, our
team's been amazing. It's a small team, but it's a good team. And, um, like our, my understanding
is that our costs have aside from some issues lately, our costs have actually gone down
in some ways. I know that they haven't gone down in other ways, but they have come down
in some ways. So we're, we're, we're holding up, we're holding up great over here. Yeah,
we're doing good. Yep. All right. But yeah, like stuff like this is going to happen, which
is uncomfortable, but the same advice that we've always given, if any creators watching
that cares to hear it, um, is to diverse, diversify, get in, get into merch stuff. Uh,
if you're a Twitch only streamer, start putting some VODs on YouTube, start finding a way
to VODify some of your content, whether that's planning out content that is specifically
made to become a VOD, um, get a, get an editor, get them to watch your streams and find interesting
segments and cut them out and title them properly and thumbnail them properly and throw them
up, do whatever, but diversify, get yourself out there. Even if you don't do like traditional
YouTube VODs, you should absolutely be doing shorts, which leads us really well into our
next topic here. Uh, this is straight out of the YouTube blog, but this week YouTube
announced that starting early 2023 creators will be eligible for revenue sharing on shorts,
but it's going to work really differently from the way that the revenue share works
for the traditional YouTube partner program. And there's some actually pretty good reasons
for it. I don't agree with everything YouTube does. I think I've made it very clear to everyone.
I think internally here, I talk about it a lot. I think outwardly on the WAN show and
in our videos, I talk about it a lot and I definitely talk about it to YouTube employees
and executives a lot. I do not agree with everything YouTube does, but this I'm looking
at going, I actually do not have a better solution to this. It's pretty smart. So with
traditional VOD or a live stream like this one on YouTube, the ads that run against your
video, uh, are credited to you and then you split it. I forget what exactly the split
percentages, but you split it with YouTube and you keep your part, they keep their part
and everybody's happy. But here's the problem with shorts. You don't have an ad like against
your short. The ad is going to be between some shorts and not all of them. And not all
of them. So it can't be just like luck of the draw. You happen to get ads in front of
your shorts and then you get paid. And so what the next three people that didn't get
as they just don't get paid. Well, that's stupid, right? So, um, the revenue from ads
that run between shorts are going to be put into a pool. Okay. But it's a little complicated
because there's kind of two pools. There's one pool for shorts that do not have licensed
music. And there's another pool for shorts that contain licensed music. So like popular
music and we'll talk about why they have to do that in a little bit. So of the pool creators
will keep 45% of the revenue. So of that bucket based on their share of total shorts views.
And that's the same whether they use music or not. The difference is that in the music
bucket, the rights holders for the music get paid first before the split between creators
and YouTube. And the reason for that is that YouTube and the music industry had to do something
about TikTok. It's clear that one of the most compelling things about TikTok is that you
can use popular songs and dance to them or lip sync to them or do whatever else it is
with them as your soundtrack, um, for no cost. And the reason for that is that ByteDance
just doesn't respect copyright. So they just are like, yeah. Um, so I guess in a way you
could look at that as a positive overall for the industry because it forced, it forced
the recording industry to come to the table and find a fucking solution, which is good
because we've actually looked into licensing real songs for our videos before. The costs
make no sense. There's all this just stupid red tape. Like it's utterly unattainable for
anyone who's not a fairly large scale production. Like it just doesn't make any sense. If I'm
only going to make $400 on this video, no, I'm not going to pay you $10,000 for an expiring
license for the music. So what I have to take the video down after you, what are you an
artist? Like, no, I'm not going to do that. It's not like people are using this video
to listen to the song. It's just for like montage. Like go touch grass. Like it's just
dumb. Get out in the real world. It's not how this works. So what it did is it forced
the music industry and YouTube didn't tell me any of this. This is all speculation, but
it's just very obvious. It forced the recording industry to come to the table and make a deal
because otherwise TikTok is just going to run amok forever and there's going to be no
way to combat that aspect of the platform.
So this is a super smart way to do it because it rewards creators no matter what, whether
they license music or don't license music, whether they get an ad in front of their video,
they don't get an ad in front of their video. And what it looks like, at least on the surface,
I haven't seen the payout rates yet, but what it looks like is that compared to TikTok,
it is going to all of a sudden become sustainable to make short form videos and not just have
to do sponsorships. Like to actually enjoy a share of the ad based revenue from the platform,
which TikTok famously does not give anyone. So they just steal music, take all the revenue
from their users and are like, well, yeah, no, screw you too. Like, why are we tolerating
this? I don't get it.
It's been very weird. You were talking to call me Chris and you, you talked about revenue
share stuff, right?
Yeah.
Like that's
Like, it's a, it's a joke on TikTok. They get like nothing.
Yeah. Crazy.
Shorts creators are added to the partner program if they get 10 million shorts views in the
last 90 days and have a thousand subscribers. Creators can still get into the YouTube partner
program with 4,000 watch hours over the last year as well. So there's, there's two paths
into the partner program. It's a lot of watch hours on shorts content. So it's going to
result in you being a big creator either way.
Also launching next year is creator music, which will allow creators to purchase a license
or opt for revenue sharing for commercial songs. They might want to use in their long
format videos, which is super cool.
Really cool.
Our discussion question here from Jonathan Horst is, is there a place for commercial
music and LTT videos?
Yes.
I was about to say, well, I'm sure as hell not sharing my revenue with them and I'm probably
not going to pay whatever they're going to ask. So probably not. We pay very little for
our existing music library and we've never had a complaint about our music.
I guess I'd have to narrow it down. There's one specific, uh, I almost said create a warehouse.
I don't know why. One specific channel, super fun video.
Oh yes. That one. Yeah. I, I, yeah. I, you know what? I even re upload it with the proper
Kenny logins playing with the boys song. Yeah, I would do it. I'll pay for it. Sure. Okay.
I'll commit to that.
If there, if there was a way to effectively do it that you knew was good and maybe the
pricing wasn't just literally the worst thing in the world. Uh, I could see it being used
for hyper specific content, but that's about it. Yeah.
Uh, Sam Joe X asks, why can't YouTube remove these dumb monetization requirements since
they did it to prevent ads from showing on stolen videos and they monetize everything
anyway now? Uh, the answer is because it's a, it's a ton of administrative work to pay
people out and sorry, but like the $4 or whatever is just not actually worth the administrative
burden for them. That's my, that's my best guess, but I'm guessing, uh, as for like shorts,
I could see us using it since there doesn't really seem to be a penalty for just using
it. Um, if we're, if we're going to have to like kind of pay for it anyway, then I guess
we might as well just go for it. But I don't know what kind of shorts that I would do that
would require licensed music. It's just one of those things that I'm so conditioned to
avoid. Yeah. You know, even if I'm, I don't think it's needed anyways for the type of
content that we do. I, whatever. Oh, ho ho. Someone in full plain chat said Rick roll
us. You could Rick roll people. Wow. Yeah, that makes sense. Does Rick roll return? Cause
you can monetize it now. I wouldn't be able to Rick roll them on float plan though. Yeah,
I get owned. My license would be platform specific. Yeah, I get owned. Well, no, I mean
that's, that's bad. Okay. Get, get on it. Get the RIA on the phone because I want you
to Rick roll people. I'm flipping and got you boys. Let's go. Oh my God. We should probably
get into some super chats here. We don't do those here. Oh, we're crying out loud. Merch
calling them super chat. How do I keep calling them super chat? Come on. All right. We have
a, we have another topic. Do we only have five birch messages today? Is this right?
The pending ones. Oh, okay. You want me to go through this video game donkey topic while
you look at some potentials? Yeah, sure. YouTuber video game donkey starts game publishing company
big mode. Also known as a, his plan is for indie games, indie game publishing company.
Video game donkey is a popular video game reviewer. Very true. 7.2 million subscribers,
11 years of YouTube videos, almost 1 million followers on Twitch. Him and his partner Leah
are starting a publishing company known as big mode, a passionate voice for quality originality
and fun indie games. He's also asked for indie studios to apply. The form asks mostly standard
questions, but there's a box to tick at the bottom to confirm that your game doesn't include
NFTs crypto or blockchain technology. And there is elsewhere on the site where it says
that they are not interested in those as well. The online community has had some opinions.
There's been a lot of people weighing in on this, which is pretty interesting. Danny O'Dwyer
from Noclip says, among many other things, including things that are slightly more positive,
like wishing them good luck and stuff like that, if I remember correctly. There is one
quote though, in his many tweets where he says, we got to drop the naive shtick that
having opinions on games is a qualification for understanding just about anything about
development. And I will, I will add in square brackets or publishing. Rami Ismail, which
I hope hopefully pronounced that correctly. Vlambeer co-founder says, if what a publisher
has proven is money and a YouTube channel, assume the worst case scenario for your business
considerations. They might F up those and thus the game might never ship or not be supported.
I will also say that again, in the expanded portion of his tweets, there was more positive
notes. And he mentioned that a way kind of around this is to ask for more money until
the publisher is more proven, which seems pretty reasonable. Vlambeer has been around
for a while. That probably comes from knowledge and experience. The, Oh, you put the thing
in front, the Celeste developer Noel Berry. Hopefully I'm saying that right as well. Noel?
Noel is pro Dunkey. I don't have exact quote from the tweets, but you can look them up.
And then Mike Rose, who I don't remember. I think he started a publisher here. I've
got my, I've got it up three different huge YouTubers, not Dunkey asked for calls with
me in the last 18 months saying they're starting their own publisher and could they get some
advice? So pretty sure we're about to see an influx of, I could do that. YouTubers having
a pop at publishing. Yeah. It's interesting. It's very interesting. There's a lot of, I
could do that YouTubers right now. Yeah. I could make a screwdriver. Yeah, exactly. I
think it's pretty interesting. I think it's pretty cool. If I was an indie developer,
would I hitch my horse onto this? Hitch my carriage onto this horse. There we go. I got
there. I don't know. Not so sure about that. I'd be interested in maybe talking to him,
but I think the Ramy Ismail's comments were actually very good. If you read through his
stuff. I'm going to make an observation. Something that we've realized as part of building products
that we think have an appeal beyond just our traditional audience, like the screwdriver
is that we actually don't know pretty much anything about traditional marketing. We have
our marketing arm built in to our company because it's like the videos and it is crazy
powerful, super powerful to the point where, you know, almost anything else just feels
like this, this tiny drop in an infinite bucket by comparison, just utter waste of time. But
lots of companies, billion dollar companies do not market themselves via just making their
own YouTube videos, obviously. And so my concern would be that just because you have some business
savvy, I like to think I do, doesn't necessarily mean that you actually know anything about
these other businesses. And maybe you have the savvy to hire people who know what they're
doing, in which case power to you. But maybe you don't. And maybe you don't have that expertise
when it comes to HR and business management. And I don't know, I don't know video game
donkey. So I'm, this is all just me speaking from my own experience and talking about how
my own expertise in one area does not necessarily translate to another.
I do know that donkey making videos about games has really springboarded those games
in the past. I do think that they were often fantastic games, which is why he made the
video about them. And they probably would have done pretty well without that. But there
have also been indie games out there in the past that have not really made it, that I
think were really good and just didn't make it because the word just didn't get out far
enough. Apparently the Celeste developer specifically brought up that donkey discovered their game
during development and made a very early video that greatly helped their sales. And that
makes sense.
I'm a flanker says, if you're an indie dev, bear in mind that the average game on steam
makes a grand total of $17,000. So the risk if you aren't picked up by a mainstream publisher,
I don't know, it kind of devolves here. Yeah, I guess it's big. So maybe the influencer
yeah, maybe the influencer could do better than $17,000. I mean, almost certainly, I
guess. So then it's Daniel Dwyer says some stuff that I think is pretty interesting.
Where is it? You know, it's like, I don't know where his comments were. I thought it
was Danny that said it.
Apparently, that's the average not median. Yeah, so that's scary, because that includes
games that you know, make 10s or hundreds of millions of dollars.
Yeah. We'll think about like Barrow. There's a lot of junk on steam. Yeah. Okay, no offense,
Barrow, Barrow, Barrow 2020. Yeah, it's mine and Luke's favorite game. Yeah, let's see
how many let's see if we can sell $17,000 of Barrow 2020. At the price, I think literally
all of you would have to buy it.
Danny talks about some of the things that video game publishers have to do. I think
it was Danny. I don't know. Maybe it's someone else. I don't want to put words in his mouth.
I can't find the tweet right now. So disregard. But someone made tweets talking about some
of the things that video game publishers have to do, and how he questions the ability slash
experience of people that haven't ever done it before. Yeah. And basing the entire publisher
thing on Dunkey's knowledge and experience with games, and also his YouTube channel is
a lot. When there's other things that publishers do, like, if I remember correctly, it's like
finding QA, getting localization support, getting certain deals from different platforms,
like like consoles and stuff, like if I was if I would expect my publisher to help me
with like music licensing, potentially, like, I would expect them to make connections for
me, there's more stuff to it, traditionally, than just some input, which could be really
good. Sure. And also being able to advertise it, effectively, maybe like a smarter way
would be for Dunkey to like, and I, again, I don't I've never watched one of his videos,
I take this for what it is. But maybe maybe a less all in, you know, angle would be to
find, you know, say you're looking for indie game projects to like invest in, be more of
like a like a like a kingmaker, like a connection, a connection maker, you know, help people
get from the point of having a really good concept to, to getting on board with a more
traditional publisher. I don't know, I'm just, I, if I had to guess, I'd say it probably
comes from a good place. Like, I'm sure there's problems in the industry in the indie publishing
space. And maybe he's trying to solve them. But maybe there are maybe there are other
ways that that could be done. I mean, who knows, maybe five years from now, you know,
they're going to have a bunch of, you know, really amazing indie games published, and
they're going to absolutely crush it. But I just don't know. Maybe Yeah. Well, Barrow
is $7.50. Now don't buy it for that. I think I bought it for way too expensive. I'm pretty
sure it was $1. Yeah, don't don't spend more than $1 on Barrow 2020. We bought it as a
joke because it was $1 don't $7 is a little bit more than a joke. What was I gonna say?
Yeah, I don't know. I, I do think that there has been a lot of comments made externally
without a ton of comments made from Dunkey. The site's up, and there's a video. And that's
it. He hasn't responded to anything. Maybe they brought I know him and his partner Leah
started it. Maybe there's more people there. There's a talent search on the website that
says they're hiring people. It does say that they're hiring people involved with making
games, not necessarily hiring people involved with publishing. But like, I don't know, I
wouldn't write it off yet. Dunkey's been around for a long time. I'm sure this isn't just
like, you know, stupidly made. I'm sure there's a little bit more thought process to it. Hope
so. We'll see though. I don't know. The website does obviously feel very early on. The fact
that they have a tab for games already, even though they launched like, now is optimistic.
Yeah. It takes a while to make things, you know? Okay. Yeah. Conrad from the float plane
team says I have total faith in Dunkey. All right. All right. We should do for a few,
do a few more merge messages. Good job. You got it. Okay. I'm a good boy. All right. First
message here from Anan. People made fun of me when I said Anan, but I feel like that's
correct. Hey guys decided to buy the sad Linus pad and as a Christmas gift for my brother,
what has been your guys's favorite gifts you've ever given or received? Oh, one year. My girlfriend
gave me this like leather. It looks like a professor's bag. Yeah. I was like, what? That's
weird, but it was heavy. So I was like, okay, there's something in it. And I opened it up
and she made, cause I'm probably hard to give gifts for cause I don't care about all that
much. And if I do, I probably have it. So she did something really cool, which was she
filled it as if I was a Pokemon professor going out for like a day and it had a lot
of things that were like actually really, really cool. And it was genuinely really,
really well thought out. And that's like one of the coolest things that I think I've, I've
received. Yvonne's made me like a ton of stuff. Like my wallet is handmade. She made me this
like cross-stitch Linus in a blanket. She used to give me a scrapbook of our year together
every year for like the first five or six years. That's pretty cool. So I I'd say just
she gave me my TJ07 case. My first pair of like really nice headphones. I'd say just
like just about anything from Yvonne. It's usually pretty, pretty sick. As for the best,
the best one I ever came up with, man, I don't, I don't know. Like I've, I've definitely come
up with some like pretty good, like corny ideas. Cause that's what Yvonne's into. Like
this one time back when we were dating, I, I made like a spoof of like a driver's license,
but it's like a happiness license. And it's like, cause we'll be together forever. Expires
never. Wow. And like on like, just like, like, yeah, I was just like so cheesy. I got it
laminated and everything. I had completely forgotten about it until she showed it to
me recently. AJ says, so the kids are not the best thing she gave you. Hey, I was involved.
I helped make those. I mean, my part's like pretty fun compared to, yeah, sure. Yeah.
You're definitely super involved. Oh man. That's very funny. All right. Next up. Next
question here is from Ryan. What are the pros and cons to connecting my PSU to a 220 volt
power? And did you consider using 220 for your personal setup? I am using 220 for my
personal setup. Uh, the pros and cons are pro it's more efficient. Con it's 220 volts.
So you got to go find a 220 volt outlet in your house. If you don't already have one,
cause you're in Europe, um, that that's about it. Yeah. It's more efficient, which is pretty
cool from Fabian with EVGA pulling out of GPUs. Do you think more niche brands like
Yeston and with their waifu GPUs might be able to expand out and fill the space? I don't
think so. I think, I think really it's going to be the, like the, the big, the big three
year MSI is your gigabytes or uses. I don't think as rock has an Nvidia board partnership.
I think they're AMD only. Um, yeah, I just, I just don't see it in the North American
market. Like at the end of the day, it always comes down to manufacturing capacity and they
just have the most, the Nvidia can't ignore them. They can't not allocate to them. I mean,
well they might, but that's, it's stupid. Like they, they kind of need each other. It's
like a, it's like a toxic codependent relationship at this point. Question here from anon. My
wife and I are both devs and we share our laptop and desktops. Any suggestions on reliably
running windows as VMs so we don't step on each other's environments? I can't really
speak to that. I don't know what you would need that different user accounts wouldn't
accomplish. Like, yeah, I like different user accounts. If you want to be super hardcore
about it. I have also preferred just different partitions. If it's really important to keep
them very separated, just yeah. Like if you both have like NDAs that you literally cannot
have your spouse or whatever. Partition them out, dude. Yeah. Yeah. That would work. Then
you could just have them each like bit locker. We can do just like two separate drives even
would definitely work in the desktop. I suggest I have made suggestions to our own devs for
partitions. Yeah. From Igor with all the tech you own. Sorry, it's my accent. With all the
tech you own phones, wearables, handhelds, PCs, et cetera. Do you miss the times when
you only had one or two devices? Do you feel like you have less time during the day with
everything you use not to keep charged? I've been working on this a little bit personally.
I had TikTok installed for I think about a week. And then I realized that my brain was
slowly turning into a useless goo. And then I uninstalled it and was like, no. And I've
been, there was a while back where I was like really into Reddit. And then I was like, nope,
that's got to stop. I think it's all designed to be so addictive. It's not the device that's
the problem. Yes. It's the services and stuff on it. I said this before on WAN Show a while
back where like everyday life is constant PVP. And I think it's very true. And you need
to be aware that basically everything is either specifically on your team, which is usually
just going to be like people. And then everything else is against you in some way. It wants
something from you. It wants your time. It wants your money. It wants something. And
you have to- You got to stop repeating yourself. Everyone
knows time is money. It wants your money. It wants your money. It wants your money.
It wants your other form of money. It wants your other more different money.
Pretty much. Yeah. It all effectively comes down to money. And you have to be aware when
you're using these things that that's happening and that has a cost on you. Even if you're
like, oh, I don't know, I've just got some time to burn. You could be doing something
else. Maybe you do want to genuinely just burn that time and that's okay. But I think
you have to understand that you could be doing something else. You could get up and go for
a walk. You could learn a new skill. If you're like, I can't learn a new skill when I'm sitting
in an elevator. Yes, you can. AJ from Floatplane makes a good point. YouTube
adding shorts is kind of ruining my life. I did the same thing as Luke, but now when
I go on YouTube, which I like actually need, shorts are alongside videos, so I can't keep
them out of my life while still enjoying my YouTube watching habits. One thing I will
say is that if you have the discipline to ignore shorts for long enough, they will actually
not put them in front of you nearly as much. That's just YouTube doing YouTube things,
but it's totally valid. One of the things that really frustrates me as a YouTube creator,
but not really a big consumer, is that I have no ways to do certain creator tasks within
the creator studio app. So if I want to post, for example, a community post or even can
I even read community posts within the studio app? I'm not sure. There might be a way for
me to do that. Let me check content. No, no, I don't. Yeah, I don't see. I don't see community
posts in the content. Yeah. So there's certain things that if I want to do them, I have to
open the consumption app and it is amazing how often it manages to put something in front
of me that I'm like, Oh, I can't look away from this. And like I'm working. Like I don't
actually, I should bring that up with them. I've been, I've been meaning to, I've been
meaning to kind of drill into them, how important I think it is that creator studio should be
for, should have all the creator stuff. And that's a big part of it is like, I got stuff
to do and I don't want the creator studio app to be a replacement for the player, but
I don't want the player to serve the purpose of the creator studio app. I'm, I'm in a very
different mindset when I am working versus when I am idly, you know, consuming YouTube
videos. Yeah. A long answer, but yeah. Next question here from Lachlan. Hi, Linus. I was
wondering how you are liking your Sony a 95 K TV in the new house after having it for
a few months. I recently bought one as an upgrade from a 10 year old LCD and love it.
Agreed. It's the best TV on the market. And it's really, really good. It's really funny.
I came home from my trip last night and my son was sitting in the family room watching
a movie. I was like, Hey, you know, there's a theater downstairs, right? He's like, yeah.
Why do I even bother? You know what I would have given for a theater at his age? Question
here from Michael for some future proofing. What would you re would you recommend? Well,
this is a hard sentence for me for some future proofing. What would you recommend for a Zen
four CPU, the rise of nine 7,900 X or the rise of nine 79 50 X well purposes, gaming
streaming and unreal five game development. Because I know the answer. I won't say anything.
Future-proofing is a bad way to go about it. Don't plan that way. Nice. Sorry. You're just
going to have to wait and see what the performance of these CPU uses. They're not out yet. They're
coming soonish. I think maybe, maybe chat will, uh, maybe chat will discuss it and you
guys can have some good conversation about it, but I cannot, uh, join in. There's so
many, the second you throw around future-proofing, it's a very frustrating term to deal with
because the second you throw around that term, your, your budget, your disposable income,
your interest in the product, all these different things come up. They, they, they all come
up and they, you, you cannot define them very easily at all to any other people. And if
you could, it's going to take a lot of writing. That's a better type of question for something
like the new builds and planning section of the forum. Um, so you can get way more into,
into depth with it, but planning a build for future-proofing is often a flawed way of approaching
the build in my opinion. Um, so answering that question is just kind of like, yeah,
it's tough. Yeah. Next question here is from Tyler. I liked hearing about Canadian versus
Chinese molding in your screwdriver supply chain and would love to hear more about this
on everything on the LTT store. What are some challenges you faced with finding North American
based suppliers for your products?
So I wanted to use this opportunity to blast the newsletter. Yeah. Greater warehouse has
a newsletter where they talk about this type of stuff. Yeah. Um, not as often as I'd like,
but they're working on it. There's some, there's some really interesting articles on there
and there's an archive on the website. Um, I don't actually know where the archive is
on our current site cause I know where it is on the new theme that's coming. Oh, bloody
hell. Um, okay. Well yeah, I don't, but there will be an archive on the new theme. I'm pretty
sure there is one that you can find on the current theme. I just don't know where it
is. I do not see it. Okay. Okay. Yeah. Uh, anyway, um, I would say, I don't know. I can
talk about a couple of things. So, uh, when the, when the COVID shutdowns were hitting
China really hard near the beginning of what would it be like, like maybe mid 2020 let's
say, uh, mid to late 2020 we explored heavily getting garments made here in Canada. And
what we ultimately discovered was that there was no stock of anything. So you would pretty
much have to wait for whatever fabric supplier to order from China. So it wasn't going to
help us smooth out our, um, our procurement issues. And then the second problem was that
the quality of the actual production over here was just not even close, just like pockets
like this crooked and like just, Oh, like it was utterly unusable. We, we explored doing
like a whole line, like made in Canada line. And, um, it's not, I'm not saying that nothing
made in Canada would be good. I'm saying that whatever manufacturing capacity there is in
Canada is probably privately held and privately utilized and, or is pretty bottom tier, um,
or is, or is being used, um, like a lot of it would be like short run types of projects.
Like if you need to, you, you have a conference in two months and you need, uh, jackets for
all your team members, you might get something like that done here. And so the, the, the
standards for quality might not be as high, but that might not matter. Or they might be
really high and you might be paying like $900 a jacket or whatever. And that's not something
that we'd be able to market to you guys. You don't, you're not gonna, you're not gonna
pay that. Uh, and to be clear, I pulled that number out of my butt. It could be a lot less
than that.
Never say never. Maybe there's, you know, double digit inflation for a bunch of years
or something and jackets start costing $900.
Uh, yeah, sure. But like, um, there's another thing we tried to get done in Canada. We tried
to get the ABCs of gaming printed in Canada and literally every single so-called printer
in Canada was just outsourcing to China anyway. So we were like, um, K and we sourced it from
China and the quality is great. And like we get so many reviews on the site about how
amazing the quality of ABCs of gaming is like compared to their other board books. And it's
like, yeah, cause we just like found and validated a good Chinese factory and that like, that's
the thing in China is it was really eyeopening to hear the molding guys talk about it where
in China, um, you can absolutely pay the exact same amount that you would pay here and get
a great quality product like you might get here. Um, or you can tell them, look, I only
want to pay a quarter as much and they will, yeah, they'll happily make something for you.
That's a quarter of the quality.
So this perception that Chinese manufacturing is like tier and bad quality, a lot of it,
not all, but a lot of it has to do with companies over here wanting to pay a very low, wanting
to pay a small amount of money and ending up with a to your product. Like it's makes
sense. Yeah. Yeah. Hilarious. Next question here is from Carson. What's your opinion on
the new PSU spec and the necessity of it? It sucks for people like me who just bought
a nicer PSU, hoping it would last long, but now according to JC cents, there are risks
with mixing an old PSU with a new GPU and that's why future proofing sucks. I mean,
if you bought a thousand watt power supply back in like 2005, 2006, actually, I don't
think they had really hit by that point. Let's say 2008 you got a solid 14 years out of it.
You sure did. And that's still why future proofing sucks. Yeah, exactly. You didn't
like know if that was going to be a thing or not. Uh, yeah. Yeah. Um, we haven't done
a video about ATX 3.0 yet. So the truth of the matter is I haven't really looked into
it that much. I know that we want to get our chroma set up so that we can evaluate ATX
3.0 power supplies. I know the first ones have hit the market now. Silverstone has one
that's available for purchase now, but we have not gotten our training from chroma yet.
So we're not quite ready to evaluate power supplies, but it will come very soon. I skimmed
Jay's video on it. Sorry, Jay. I was busy. I didn't have time to really sit down and
dedicate watch time to it, but it's interesting. It's very interesting. I'm excited to see
like, lab data on it, whatever. I'm excited to see people dive deeply into it, but check
out Jay's video. It's interesting. Next question here from anon. Did you ever get a resolution
to the wire fraud from earlier this year? Hoping that got sorted for you. Yeah, we got
it back through very, um, unofficial means. I told the story before. I think it's on LMG
clips. Next question here from Everett. Do you ever think we'll get, reach a point of
smaller and smaller transistor sizes that quantum tunneling will stop shrinking and
we'll have to rely on what AMD is doing with 3d stacking. Yeah, we're already there. That's
why AMD is 3d stacking. Yep. It's the writing's been on the wall for a long time. That's why
they've been developing these technologies. Absolutely. Oops. Sorry. Are we playing foot
C? Oh, down. Let's do it. I'm going to try to reach really far so I can join it. Next
question here is from Raul. Uh, in the foreseeable future, will LTT store ever become a hub
for selling other YouTubers' merch? After the JerryRigEverything knife, I was started
to wonder. Um, I don't see why not. Any other creators? Y'all out there? You wanna, wanna
like wholesale some stuff to us? We think it's a good product. Like, I don't see why
we wouldn't carry it. I don't know, man. It's like, should we just have like creatorwarehouse.com
and like... I've been wanting Creator Warehouse to support other creators for a long time.
The way that I want them to do it is not in that way. I understand it's super hard. I
get it. Oh, like develop products for them? Yeah. I know. I know. You know, we are working
with someone big though, right? No. Yeah. Really big. I didn't. But it's going to take
time. Yeah. And it's hard and it takes upfront investment because the way that we do it is
a little different. Even from that person, it is, it is requiring a significant time
commitment. But this person has a lot of integrity and cares about the quality of the products
that they want to, they don't just want to sell stuff to their audience. The thing that
I've liked about the store the most the whole time we've had it, but more lately. Cause
like originally we were just doing like what we could and now we can do more, which is
great. But the thing that I've liked about the store is that I, I feel stoked to stand
behind our products, which is cool. I think we make good stuff. A lot of YouTuber merch,
even well-intentioned YouTuber merch is kind of junky because you do what you're supposed
to do, right? You look online, look at what other people are doing. This is what's available
to me. This is all I can really do without building a business arm, which is not realistic
for most creators, which is fine and makes sense. And those results are often kind of
junky. Yeah. So being able to have actually good stuff is cool, but it's hard. And having
the creator Rao's team be able to be that arm for these other companies I think would
be really sick. But again, that itself is really difficult and we're already dealing
with our own scale things and there's lots of work to do. So yeah, and it's tough, right?
Because like it works for us because we are taking 100% of the margin. If we had another
creator come in and say, yeah, I, uh, I want to do, uh, uh, uh, a purse. Okay. So w whatever,
right? It's like some product. So let's say that, uh, they, they wanted to target, um,
like a pretty typical retail product markup is about double. Okay. So let's say they wanted
to target a one 99 price point. Okay. So if it was for us, we have a hundred dollars to
work with to, to, to build that product. Um, while, cause you gotta understand there are
certain costs associated with a product that just scale with price. So, you know, any,
any losses from warranty, for example, it's not like, um, it's not like just because it's
a more expensive product, you can just, you can just make a maximum of $20 on every product,
no matter how much it actually costs. Um, there's also higher transaction fees on the
transaction. Like there's just, there's just fixed costs that, that go up with the value
of the product. And so it's, it's pretty typical to aim for about a hundred points on, on a
product. And so if we were operating as just this single vertically integrated entity like
we are now, then we could kind of go, okay, well then, uh, we have a hundred dollars to
work with to develop this product and we will make a hundred dollars on it. This is all
purely hypothetical and I've used these simple, uh, one to two ratios before for cost to,
to retail price. It's not always that simple. We have products, we make more than that.
We have products, we make less than that. And, um, that also helps us absorb the storage
and handling and transaction fees and like all that stuff. But we're keeping the math
really, really simple. So all of a sudden we are not acting as a vertically integrated
company where the creator and the creating company are one essentially. Now we're creator
warehouse and we're working with another person. Okay. So of that a hundred dollars, what's
that split? Um, if, if it's 90, 10, if they take 90 of it and we take 10, that sounds
pretty good for them cause they don't have to like build a business arm, like you said
to create these products. But is that even worth our time? If we're selling these $200
products and we're taking home $10 of that hundred dollars of margin, why did we even
bother? Unless we, unless we are going to sell like a hundred thousand of them or something.
Um, the, the, the, the, the multiple people that are probably, cause any product you're
going to sell that many of, I guarantee you the development costs were substantial, well
into six figures. But I think, I think why are we bothering? So a lot of what I would,
I guess, bring up is that the thing that I liked the most about our stuff is the quality
of it, but that's exactly it. And maybe I was getting there. Hold on. I was going to
get there. Hold on. I was going to get there. Hold on. Maybe we don't do purses. Well, okay.
We have our own blanks for shirts and we have consistent, really high quality and the printing's
good and we have bottles and we have other stuff. Okay. But hold on, let's go back to,
let's go back to the margin question then. Okay. So, so we have to figure out that it
has to be enough margin for us to get out of bed because otherwise we could have made
our own purse. Yep. Right. Okay. So then we need more than 10% probably. So then from
their side, okay, well it has to be enough for me to bother getting out of bed because
at the end of the day, I'm the one who has to be involved in the design process for this.
I have to sell it. It has my name on it and ultimately reflects on me if it's bad. So
they're taking a lot of, they're taking a lot of inherent risk in, in undertaking this.
So we might go, okay, fine. $100 isn't enough for us to split. So now the final price needs
to be 250 bucks. So we each get 75 and now we're happy. Hypothetically, right? So we're
both making less. The price went up to you by involving these multiple entities. Now
it doesn't, I know people are going to be like, um, it doesn't work like that. Yeah,
you're right. You're right. You're right. That's not how it works. But the point is
that the more entities involved in this process, the more ways that whatever margin there is
is split and the more it drives up the finished cost. And so, you know, from my point of view
and you guys might think, oh, you're being greedy. 10% should be lots, right? Well, okay,
well who's doing customer support? Am I handling that? No. Why not? Because they don't want
to build a business arm, right? If they don't want to build a business arm, well then why
are they doing support? Well, we should be a one-stop shop. Okay, well then I need more
margin because we run their Shopify pages. Yeah. Okay. So what do I have the login? Okay.
At that point, who owns the shop? Do I, or do you, am I licensing your brand now at that
point? That's not how that works. There's a few things in here that I don't think we're
lining up on. One, the Shopify page thing, running their Shopify page, would require
a login, but would not require ownership of the site. No, but it could. But why? It just
could. Okay. Because at that point, you don't need that for customer support. You don't
need that for development. You don't need that for marketing. I just mean it's complicated.
Yeah, but I think it's less complicated than you're showing. Well, it can be. Yeah. So
make it less. Well, okay, fine. What do you want me to do? I think new product development
would only be for very, very specific creators and at very, very high volume. Which is something
we're doing. Yeah. Existing product though? Sure. Shirt, bottles. I think that's a lot
easier than you're letting on. It is. Design is almost certainly going to be done by them,
or we could have like a more premium track where you work with our designers. It's still
more complicated than that though. Cause when we print the design, right? So we get it printed,
we have a shirt. Now what? Are they local? Can we show it to them and make sure that
the colors meet their needs? Is it what they envisioned when they designed it on their
screen? Is their screen even color accurate? I don't know. Just ship it to them. Okay.
But then now you're adding extra time. They'll have a hard time doing anything timely at
that point. Cause we have to get their design, get it printed, get it back, ship it to them,
get their confirmation, this kind of multi-step process. And you know, I don't think it adds
a step, you know, from communicating with printer to us, just go printer to them, you
know, from community. Well, it doesn't because we picked them up locally. We have a printed
local and you know, from communicating with creators, they are not as they really, really,
really, really loved to know they are the worst. Yeah. They actually are myself included
and me. Yeah. So it's, it's one of those things where it's like, I know I'm over-complicating
it, but you're oversimplifying it. I think it's probably true on both sides. Yeah.
It sounds fair. Cool. Next one. All right. Final question here from anon. What games
you guys currently enjoying? Toying with Luke. I feel like we've been getting this question
a lot lately. So my answer is aren't really changing. I also didn't really play games
for the last week and I'm pretty sure this question came up last week. I played some
super meat boy on the plane. It's been a little while. I was a plus on some levels. I played
golf story on the plane. Nice. Yeah. Nice. Which I guess we'll talk about this golf story.
One of my favorite switch games that came out really fantastic game. Sports story. I
think was supposed to be the follow-up sports story. How's that going? Not well, which is
why I kind of wanted to mention it. Sidebar games was developing it. I think sidebar games
is like a two-bit studio. There was a trailer that went up on Nintendo's YouTube channel
for sports story that looked awesome. It looked like gameplay. It looked awesome. But it seems
like the project might be dead, which is super sad because golf story was actually amazing.
And even playing it again, I beat the whole thing before. There wasn't really anything
else for me to do on the plane. My girlfriend had her switch there. I didn't bring mine.
She had golf story on it though. So I was like, sweet, I'll just play this again. It
was great. I really enjoyed it. And I really hope that they finished development on sports
story because I would love to play it. Well, they haven't updated Twitter since December
2021, but, but, but the time before that was in June of 2021. So maybe this is on brand
for them. I don't know. They are far off their schedule. If I remember correctly, based on
like the video and stuff, I haven't replied to anything since then. Yep. It's looking
rough, but if you're out there, there's interest, please, please make game. You will sell at
least one copy. I'll buy it. But yeah. Yeah. Same answers as other times or no, when I'm
walking around, uh, been playing some, uh, a little bit of Tarkov, not very much, a little
bit of sniper elite, not very much, a little bit of Star Citizen, not very much. There
you go. I think that's it. I think that's all. Thanks for watching. We'll see you again
next week. Same bad time. Nope. Same bad channel. I won't touch that. Yep. And bye.
I love that you will sell at least one. Uh, the show is brought to you today by shadow
and epidemic sound. The button wasn't available. The show is still going. Oh, what are we going
to do? Is he going to click it? I thought I'm supposed to wait a little bit. Oh yeah.
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That makes sense. Got to wait until yeah. Yeah, no, I've, I've
got it. I've got it. I've got it. I've got it.